Frustrating Slab Design 10

[SteelPE]

Got fired from a portion of a project today.

Client has an industrial facility and asked me to design a slab for them. I am in the process of completing the design of an addition at the facility. Facility has 100 tanks for various products that weigh anywhere from 1 kip to 150 kips. They sent me an excel spreadsheet yesterday listing equipment weights and a schematic layout of the equipment on the slab. Client also has three outdoor silos that need foundations. Again, client gave weights and positions but nothing else yesterday.

I asked the client through an email for support conditions (posts vs uniform loading.... post spacing, base plate sizes etc) and on the exterior silo I asked for dimensions of the silo and support conditions (including if any reactions were available from the mfr).

Woke up this morning to being fired for another engineer who is "just going to do it".... whatever that means. Don't know how you can "just do it" without that information.

Keep in mind, I found out about this slab design request yesterday.

Incredibly frustrating.

 

[phamENG]

"just doing it" likely means:

a) an assumption of uniform loading that will result in an under-designed slab that won't perform and likely cost them lots of money later in maintenance/repair costs OR
b) an 18" thick heavily reinforced mat slab foundation where an 8" slab with moderate reinforcement maybe a few thick spots for point loads would have done the job, costing the client several 10s if not 100s of thousands of dollars on the front end.

In either case, serves them right.

Sorry about the getting fired part, though - that's never fun. In situations like this, though, the silver lining usually obscures the storm cloud pretty well in the end.

 

[jayrod12]

I've started to consider these blessings in disguise.

I got dropped on a fairly large addition. It would have been the second go around on the design, the first one got to final board approval (66% design documents) and was cut. When it restarted, we were not requested to be a part of the design team, even though the rest of the consultants were the same, and the client is one that I have, and continue to do, all of their modification and plant work. It was a sales job by the M&E consultant saying they have structural as well and they could provide all the services but Architectural, and the newer project manager for the client thought that sounded great.

I, like you, was extremely upset at the time. I never got asked to even through a proposal at it. Seemed unfair.

I still talk regularly with the architectural consultant, and other employees for the client. They have indicated to me that even though we didn't get the fees for the redesign, we're probably far better off because the design aspect this time around has been a complete disaster. Turns out I knew the client's internal operations and needs better than their own project manager, so it has resulted in many avoidable redesigns late in the game, poor coordination and planning on the client's end, and all in all just one of those bad projects.

So although you're upset now. It's probably for the best.

 

[JAE]

I've started to consider these blessings in disguise.

That's exactly what they are.

 

[JStructsteel]

Dodged a huge bullet. Don't entertain their calls anymore for any job.
Bill them for the overnight work you did.....10 hours at 200$ a hour. See if they pay.

 

[SteelPE]

Only work I had into the slab design was a review of the documentation and a list of questions that I had about the information they provided me.

In reality, the addition that I am a part of is spiraling out of control with regards to "added scope". This would have just added to the overall scope of the project as a whole (completing the analysis of the existing interior slab). I just get frustrated with asking questions and people acting like I'm being a jerk for doing the job that I am asked to do.

 

[Aesur]

Welcome to the life of an engineer who actually knows what they are doing and isn't just a yes man. I agree with other comments here, take it as a blessing. There have been a few projects I wish I was fired from based on scope creep, forgotten SSI, "we built it different from your plans, is this ok", contractors arguing "this isn't how we normally do it" and the likes..

 

[WARose]

Yeah, I've seen this movie before myself. What I can't get over is how agitated some of 'em get when I ask for drawings for a existing structure. It's like: hey, I am trying to save you money here. You really want me to go through and do that with a field inspection?

 

[jerseyshore]

It sucks, but I am glad those yes-men exist. Makes us look better in the long run even if we lose a little work on the front end because of it. Helps to justify our higher fees and quality of work.

In the end I think it all balances out because you lose some jobs like this, but gain them somewhere else to help fix a mistake or emergency situation that the so called yes-men can't handle.

 

[NorthCivil]

I try not to start any project work until i have a signed contract. I'll make exceptions for good, repeat clients with whom i have a relationship.

So that in a situation like this, if the client terminates the contract, i can still send a bill for the work completed.

The best jobs are the ones you get paid for but never get built. This sounds like one of those.

 

[ads0221]

Clients like the one your dealing with never come with happy endings.

In honesty they are looking for a yes man or someone they can push around.

If this client wants you to design and seal drawings based on “assumptions” if anything happens they’ll point their fingers at you faster than you think is possible.

Be greatful this one got away.

 

[jerseyshore]

The best jobs are the ones you get paid for but never get built.

A senior engineer once told me this exact line when I first started working and I thought it was silly. I became an engineer to build things. Boy did I learn quick this statement was dead on balls accurate.

 

[milkshakelake]

The client might be trying to cover their own ass. They weren't on top of things, so they used you as a scapegoat.

I've had several clients who didn't give information, sent it weeks later, and unapologetically expected drawings the next day. Complained about me to their bosses or whatever. These days, I hound people for info over and over again through calls and emails to get the job done and to leave a paper trail. It's mostly so I don't get blamed at the end.

 

[Tomfh]

The best jobs are the ones you get paid for but never get built.

Finding out the project has died after you finished the docs:

Finding out years later that's it come back to life:

 

[WinelandV]

Tomfh,

If it only came back to life, that'd be one thing. It usually comes back with "we want to increase the (insert dimensions here)" or "we want to increase the loading" coupled with "we already re-bid this using the original design - there shouldn't be any changes, right?"

And that's how you get tears in your coffee, folks.

Please note that is a "v" (as in Violin) not a "y".

 

[XR250]

If you have a big job that you get paid for that does not get built, it can be beneficial to discuss it with your insurance company come renewal time. They treat these differently and it does not add to your billings as much.

 

[dik]

If it comes back to life, years later, it's a whole new project.

-----*****-----
So strange to see the singularity approaching while the entire planet is rapidly turning into a hellscape. -John Coates

-Dik