hand-held devices

[rmiell]

I need some suggestions for a hand-held device for entering power plant readings which are taken on the hour, 24-7. Readings include a number different breaker's amp readings and a number of different voltage readings, as well as standard hourmeter readings.

I would like this hand-held device to be small enough to be carried easily, for the screen to be read easily, and rugged enough to stand some abuse. I would prefer format to be Windows based (Excel or Access), but I would look at different formats.

Our power plant personnel would carry this unit around to the different locations during their hourly rounds, and input the necessary data via keybord. The data would then be downloaded at end of day into a program which would store data, and print out reports.

This device will replace the large (24" X 30") paper logsheet presently used. Reports would need to be printed at end of month, for both recordkeeping and billing info.

Any recommendations? Ideas?

TIA

Rick Miell

PS. Our power plant (circa 1949) is a small plant, consisting of 9 diesel generators, but these only run in an emergency. Info gathered has to do with the substation part of the plant, such as buss voltage (69kV, 13.8kV & 2.4kV), and the circuit breaker's various loads during the 24 hour period. Other info is kwh meters for plant use only, water well consumption, transformer tap-changer positions, and a number of other items.

 

[itsmoked]

I would use a PDA as they are robust have the various Microsoft applications you mention and can be worn on the belt and wrapped in leather so drops don't destroy them.

Keith Cress
Flamin Systems, Inc.-

http://www.flaminsystems.com

 

[Zogzog]

There are several metering systems that you can install that have communication capabilities to monitor those paramaters and send the info to your computer for data logging. What type of trip units do you have on your breakers? You might already have several pieces in place.

 

[rmiell]

We are in the process of installing a SCADA system, but for this substation we are 1-2years away from having it up and running.

For now, I just want to hand record the breaker amps, buss voltage, etc.., available from panel mounted meters.

I have looked at a few pda's, but I was hopefull someone could recommend a particular brand/style. I was also hopefull that there was some plant out there that was using a setup like this.

Our SCADA system will do all this and more, but due to budget restraints, we can't obtain the required equipment right now. Most of our breakers are Cooper, both form4c and a new Form 6, and should be able to be tied directly into our existing (though new) SCADA system, via an RTU. This will be completed as soon as possible, but for the time being............

Thanks again.

Rick

 

[slavag]

Hi Rmiell.

Check this one
SATEC Inc.
10 Milltown Court
Union, NJ 07083
Tel: 1-908-686-9510
Fax: 1-908-686-9520
Contact: Ed Hoinowski
e-mail: satec@oksatec.com

and Check: PowerLogic.com

Both of them have good level of power meters with option for power Q, harmonic distorsion, sag, swell, etc. and in the future will possible connect them to SCADA via for example Modbus RS485 or Modbus TCP/IP.
Regards.
Slava

 

[jghrist]

You should be able to use the Cooper controls to automatically gather metering data in a form that can be downloaded to your computer. The Form 6 has a Data Profiler function that can be configured to retain metered data on a periodic basis. If you only need hourly data, you can probably store enough that downloads could be monthly instead of daily. The control would have to have voltage inputs connected to VTs to get voltage and power readings of course.

The Form 4C controls need a special Data Reader to get the stored metering data.

 

[slavag]

Hi.
Check also:
Sales@electroind.com ,

http://www.electroind.com

Nexus meter, also great meters with many options.
Regards.
Slava

 

[catserveng]

We are using Toshiba tablet computers with Excel spreadsheets as forms for generation techs and one sites plant operators. So far they have been rugged enough for the application, and use standard software, we then just hook them up to the network everynight and save the info to either the plant or office computers.

We tried the Palm route, but the guys spent more time scrolling thru the app then actually entering data. We also just set one up with a bar code reader to read equipment info, cuts down on techs entering info and time spent.

 

[itsmoked]

Hey catserveng, I look at all the tablet computers and they look like notebooks with flippy screens. Are there any that look like a TABLET or clipboard?

Keith Cress
Flamin Systems, Inc.-

http://www.flaminsystems.com

 

[geekEE]

There are plenty of rugged tablet PCs, but they're not cheap.

http://mobileoffice.about.com/od/tabletpcs/tp/ruggedtabletpc.htm

http://www.tabletpc2.com/CompareRugged.htm

 

[catserveng]

We are using Fujitsu ST5100's at some of our sites (sorry thought they were Toshiba's), these have done pretty good so far, but we have dropped one and it died. We use them with their docking stations for a maintenance techs.

We just got out first Geoage XPlore Tablet, a ruggedized unit for one of our customer plants. So far it has performed very well.

I don't use these units directly, but all of the techs who have them are very impressed, and it has really helped in some of our data collections and paper work issues.

No they are not cheap, the Fujitsu units run us around $2300 and the Geoage cost us $3300. But so far we have felt the cost was justified, and we are improving our data management by using them.

 

[itsmoked]

Wow ouch, ouch, ouch, ouchy!

Those prices are stratospheric. Amazing what volume does. My Inspiron with double the screen size, fast, and long lived on batteries cost far less than the least expensive tablets.

Keith Cress
Flamin Systems, Inc.-

http://www.flaminsystems.com

 

[catserveng]

That was the initial reaction here when tablets were fiirst proposed, and no doubt the cost is high for what you get. However we have seen an improvement in productivity and ability to beter use data collected in the field.

By trying to do a little more "up front", like a form with minimal input by the tech, and operating parameters that can be transferred to a means of trending and ability to look at long term changes in those parameters has improved our customer service. Problem is that is a metric hard to put a dollar value too for the bean counters.

We started down this path after a problem last year at a waster water treatment facility we help maintain the biogas fueled generators. In the middle of summer peak period one of the units tripped on high lube oil temperature. The units have hourly parameter readings taken and are supposed to be reviewed by the plant manager. After reviewing the problem we found we had a .5 degree F increase in temperature every week. Kind of hard to pick out on a day to day basis. There was early discussion to bring this data point into the plant SCADA system, but there are cost and downtime constraints, and a supposed future upgrade. So we tried this solution of a rugged tablet PC with a "standard" form, and added bar codes to the equipment to help reduce the amount of inputting the technician had to do. So far we have found a couple of minor trends that have been corrected before a plant outage. Total investment for this plant to implement this data management was less than $10k. I think we are looking at doing this again.

Not a "fit all" solution, but in some cases we think worth the cost. Hard to put a value on getting and managing operating data until things aren't running, then harder still to sit in front of a customer and tell him a $3000 plus tablet PC may be part of his solution when he uses a $700 laptop every day.

For the guy who started this post, we have worked in a lot of plants that initally used paper log sheets, just got back from a plant in the Caribbean where we asked to look at last years logs, and ended up with a box full of moldy paper. Your decision will probably be driven by what you do with the data you collect. Does someone input the field collected data into a spreadsheet or database? Do you have a problem with transcription errors? How is the data reviewed? What are the end uses of the data? You may want to look at a form of collection that will take data into a format you can move it easily, and then mine data with a software tool like Crystal Reports to develop summary reports and do trending on critical parameters. A PDA would work ok if you only have a few data points, and you have applications where you came move the data easily, at least based on our experience.

Hope that helps.

 

[itsmoked]

Thanks cat.

I wonder on this non-realtime, but near-realtime application, if simple Scantron forms wouldn't be vastly better.

You could have clip boards of them hanging around. Number the inspection locations/data, 1 thru whatever, so as you walk up to meter X there is a little plate with 18 on it. On the Scantron on line 18 you block out the data 197 for 197 degrees. When done you return to the office and drop the Scantron in the scanner. Zip, it goes into the database. Then you can toss the form into the recycling bin or into a file cabinet for battery free backup for one year.

I bet you could get all the Scantron forms for 10 years and a scanner for the price of a tablet replacement battery.

I can also bet that dropping the clipboard would not break any Scantron forms..

Keith Cress
Flamin Systems, Inc.-

http://www.flaminsystems.com