Hate my job 14

[tumbleleaves]

1) I am a civil engineer in California.
2) I have been looking for employment elsewhere, for over 3 months.
3) An across the board pay-cut was instituted at my current employment.
4) I took this job when I was laid-off due to lack of work in 2009, when construction froze up. It did not pay well, but I thought it was secure, and thought there was no way they would reduce the pay further.

I work with old people that are hanging on to their positions (protecting their turf), should have already retired and are dysfunctional and out of touch. I've been carrying these old people. Now the job bugs me so much that it affects how I feel when I'm off work, and the last couple of weeks is affecting my performance at work.

I can't afford to quit, have been unable, so far, to find a new job... How are other people doing and coping?

 

[ImminentCollapse]

This is what I get from your post:

1) I am an entitled Gen Y’er
2) I highly over-value myself
3) I highly under-value more experienced individuals
4) I blame others for my situation

“How are other people doing and coping?”

My response: When I was younger,
1) I never felt entitled
2) I had humility and understood I knew very little
3) I respected everyone and tried to learn at least something (even if it was non-technical) from everyone I worked with
4) I put myself through two masters programs, obtained licensure and joined professional organizations to take charge of my situation and improve my professional options

Doing OK now, your results may vary.

 

[tumbleleaves]

ImminentCollapse,

I was hoping for some sort of advice--not spite. This is a genuine post of someone that is frustrated in a difficult economy that has been busting their hump through thick and thin, and sees no end in sight.

Posting 4 daggers directed at me, then posting 4 in-your-face things about how great, "highly valued", virtuous, and well off you are...is well...

I am a real person, with real faults. My motivation has tapered off big-time the past few weeks.

 

[SLTA]

tumbleleaves, take a deep breath read this as from someone who wants to help you.

I think what got IC's ire up was the "old people" comments. Yes, there are probably engineers who should retire but haven't, but there is still TONS that can be learned from them.

It really is all in your attitude. If you think you're so great and should be running the show, but aren't, then you'll just dig yourself into a hole. No one wants to hire someone who is holier-than-thou, which is how your post came off.

If you take a step back and reevaluate, decide to find out what the old guys know and could teach you with an honest and open heart (not the I-want-your-job attitude you're projecting in the first post), then you might be surprised how much you can learn, and how quickly. Doors will open then.

Never expect that your pay won't get reduced. Mine went from half to let go, but now I have my own firm.

(by the way, I'm neither old nor a guy)

 

[Latexman]

I feel for ya tumbleleaves, but 3 months in this economy is not long enough. Suck yourself up, put on a happy face, and keep slogging along.

Good luck,
Latexman

 

[denoid]

Thanks, slta, from an "old guy".

 

[SAITAETGrad]

If you take the time to read closely what was said, ImminentCollapse has provided some sage advice.

To paraphrase- keep your head down, work hard, and identify what options you have to improve your situation. IC stated that he did two masters programs and joined professional organizations- he took the initiative to improve his situation. That's how you earn respect. Key word- "earn". He did this while being respectful so as to learn from all others (or at least he says/wishes).

Focus on what you can change, not what you can't.

 

[tumbleleaves]

YES. I have worked with talented old people 60+, that use AutoCAD and are very sharp. These are not the "old people" I currently work with, they can barely use Excel.

I spent the last three years sucking it up and learning, what these people had to offer--which was not a lot. I try and remember that every person is my superior in some way and that I should learn from them.

I also suspect that me doing the work has made it easier for a couple of the elders to stick around a few more years and delay retirement, which prevents me from advancing. They modified my job description, where I'm now "leading" and the "leader" of other employees, a way to make me the supervisor without calling me the supervisor, and without promoting or increasing pay.

The problem is, looking for a job is a 2nd job. Making squat, working two jobs, and not enough time for my family.

Thanks Latexman, "keep slogging along". That helps (seriously) remembering that will help get me through the next two-weeks. Slogging=This job market.

 

[TheTick]

I hate your job, too.

 

[EQguys]

tumbleleaves: I am sympathetic about your situation. I am in a similar boat, but am thankful that even in this economy I have a decent job which pays decent and I still get to learn something everyday, however trivial it might be.

My learning curve has pretty much been stagnant over the last 6 months and work is monotonous. Due to major errors committed by the so called upper management in the last year or so, our company has gotten into serious trouble with couple of clients and we are in the local news being bad-mouthed endlessly. I anticipated this beforehand but my concerns were not communicated by the senior engineers to the management.

Anyway, long story short, I am looking to change my job, but its been tough. However, I am also using this time to pursue professional licensures (lot of studying), certifications and also getting involved in professional organizations. I am getting involved in educational outreach, volunteering in local construction with NGO's and authoring couple of technical papers for publication in addition to using my lunch hour to search for other job opportunities.

I think at the end of the day, it boils down to how positive your attitude is. Hang in there and be more positive. May the force be with you

 

[tumbleleaves]

EQguys,

Interesting take, I've taken a different route:
1) Quitting my professional organizations (the two that I belong to) in order to save money and time.
2) I have two licenses. I suppose I could pursue a structural license, but at some point I will have alphabet soup after my name.
3) No time for anything other than finding a new job, and the price of eduction has gone up astronomically.

After all the hard work of pursuing a position, attending multiple interviews, making it to the final round, then being told you came in second or third is a huge let-down...all that wasted effort and expense, when I'm short on time and money.

I'm now looking out of state.

 

[SNORGY]

tumbleleaves:

I feel your pain.

The trouble is, until you can afford to quit, you can't quit.

I find what helps me is to focus only on the stuff I put on (ultimately) the paper. I can control how right or how wrong or how good or how bad that is. I cannot control the efforts of others, unless I am specifically charged with so doing - in which case, a number of options are available to me up to and including the termination of their involvement on anything that I am responsible for.

When you turn your focus into something that is "all about the deliverable" and "nothing about the people stuff", you can survive professionally and emotionally until such time as you find a place where the "people stuff" is more bearable.

I would approach my direct report and have a frank conversation with him / her about what is making you frustrated. If it's already affecting your performance and bugging you when you are away from work, then in effect you have checked out already.

You will find turf-protectors and politicians everywhere you go. I choose to let them do what they do; meanwhile, I design stuff. In other words, I care about the "stuff" first and the "people" second. Eventually, like-minded people find each other and both issues settle out in the wash.

Regards,

SNORGY.

 

[msquared48]

Been doing that for three years now, with little success.

Guess I'm one of the old guys that should retire by your perspective. Problem is that they are in the same boat you are in, maybe even worse. Like you, they need the work too.

Someday, I hope you learn that you are not entitled to anything, not even life. You have to earn it. Be what it may, be glad you have some form of a job - some of us have none, cannot get one, and not by choice.

Good hunting.

Mike McCann
MMC Engineering

http://mmcengineering.tripod.com

 

[tumbleleaves]

msquared48,

I grew up as a latch-key kid, and put myself through college, no guidance, no plan, and no financial support. I had to figure it out on my own. It's a miracle I made it this far.

Sure, the people that should retire have their reasons--they can't afford to live how they thought they were going to. Health care costs are hitting them extra hard, etc.

It's almost comical that the elders are out in force today, telling others they aren't entitled: The generation that had the most and expects the most.

I feel sorry for the younger generations with the increasing cost of education and reduced pay. Feel sorry for my own kids too.

 

[patprimmer]

Finding the right job is an expensive and time consuming task.

So is finding the right employee.

Not finding them is even more expensive.

When in an interview your employer is almost certainly at least middle aged. Showing what might be perceived (even incorrectly) as a prejudice against or lack of respect for your elders or seniors won't help your cause. Even if not meant, you OP did say something that could and was interpreted that way. Just saying.

Regards
Pat
See FAQ731-376 for tips on use of eng-tips by professional engineers &

http://eng-tips.com/market.cfm

for site rules

 

[berkshire]

tumbleleaves,
You have been around this site for a year or two and have made useful contributions.

You need to look at this from the perspective of an employer.
Right now in this down economy he/she has the problem of getting work for the people he/she has. Bidding against other companies for a shrinking pool of work meaning there is less fat in the job to cover overhead ( Don't even mention profit at this time). He/ she has a choice, cut a few people loose (Then hope to get them back when work picks up), that the others may survive, or spread the misery around with the hopes of retaining the crew until work can pick up again. It would appear that your employers have taken the latter course, to which I say more power to them.
At this stage your employer is looking for "Superman" that magical person who can get work into the door, solve problems and get even more profitable work in.
Now if you are as good as you say you are, digging in and helping your present company prosper, may work better for you than copping an attitude.
B.E.

The good engineer does not need to memorize every formula; he just needs to know where he can find them when he needs them. Old professor

 

[tumbleleaves]

Thank you all for writing in and posting great advice and making some excellent points.

A different site on the internet recommended writing into an internet forum and letting it all out--so I did, rudeness and all.

The folks that posted showed consideration and restraint, and wrote some good things. Clearly engineers as a whole are very considerate and excellent communicators, contrary to the stereotypes.

 

[spongebob007]

There's a reason they call it work. It's because work sucks. If work didn't suck, they would call it "fun". Jobs that are fun typically don't pay well. If you love your job AND it pays well, you are very lucky and you are in the minority.

There are aspects of my job that I enjoy and I have done some cool stuff, but I hate getting up every day and dealing with this BS we call corporate America. If I didn't need the money I would quit. I wouldn't even give the courtesy of two weeks notice-screw em! But unfortunately I have grown used to eating and living indoors. At the end of the day, this is why I work. I NEED the money and I have grown used to the lifestyle that my job affords me. I have only been unemployed once in my life. It was when I was about your age and I worked as a contractor for a major defense firm. The project was finsihed and my contract was over and they did not bring me on full time. I collected unemployment for two months before I finally got hired for a job that I totally hated and knew it from the get go. I had absolutely zero interest in this job and could find no excitement in the products this company made. But it paid better than unemployment (which runs out eventually). So despite the fact that I could care less, I had to put my best game face on and pretend that I really wanted the job. I worked there for a year and pretty much hated every minute of it. It was a very low tech job that probably could have been done by someone with an associates degree. But one year later I found a much better job. Sometimes you have to put up with doing stuff you don't like. Sometimes you may have to put up with it for years. That's life. It's about choices and often you have to decide what you are willing to put up with. For instance if living in California is very important to you, then you just have to suck it up and accept the fact that you may have to spend a few more years working at this craphole until things turn around. On the other hand, if you don't care where you live as long as you are satisfied with your job, it's time to do as you have started to do and expand your job search to other states or even other countries.

I wish I had happier advice, but I don't.

 

[TGS4]

This reminds me of a cartoon that a co-worker had on his wall:

A short essay on why I work:
I like food.
The end.

 

[bigTomHanks]

Pick up the phone tomorrow morning and tell your boss you are sick and won't be able to work. Then spend the day doing something for yourself. Do not worry about the work that won't get done while you aren't there. If you were to quit without notice tomorrow those people who are ridding you to the bank will have to pony up and pull their weight. I've been in your shoes where I was the junior doing all the work while the soon to be retires spent the day jaw jacking about how great they were back in the day.

It's amazing how much people realize that they take what you do for granted when you aren't there to do it. A seemingly simple task that you perform all of the sudden become a major disaster for your boss when you aren't there.