Health Insurance 44

[tbonebanjo]

I was just wondering how many companies still have good insurance and how many have gone the way of Obamacare. I am in a small MEP firm in Maryland. Our health insurance just changed, our premiums went up and our coverage went way down. I have maximum out of pocket expenses of $12,500 per year, $4000 deductable per person, tnen start the copay schedules. Should I start looking for other employment or are all companies being affected this way?

 

[KENAT]

" And flipping the switch between private cost sharing and public cost sharing will do nothing to fix that feedback loop."

Depends to some extent on how it's implemented as I think I alluded to above.

Not that the lawyers and politicians would necessarily allow it (seeing as many politicians trained as lawyers) potentially going to govt central payer the malpractice suits could be significantly reduced if not eliminated entirely due to certain constitutional rights. In turn this could reduce some of the defensive medicine. Likewise no one directly getting money just from giving MRI's etc. removes their incentive to do as many as possible and so on.

Posting guidelines faq731-376

http://eng-tips.com/market.cfm?

(probably not aimed specifically at you)
What is Engineering anyway: faq1088-1484​

 

[beej67]

The MRI guys would still get money from the MRIs. If it went public, they'd just have to shift their "Market our MRI Services" expenditures over to lobbying expenditures, and pass laws or codify regulations requiring MRIs under certain circumstances which exceed those actually necessary, "for our own good."

They already did exactly that with all the Obamacare plans. Forced things we don't need onto the plans, at the behest of lobbyists.

The fundamental problem is that government in the USA is broken, so any attempt to grant it more power just allows the people who broke it to break it further.


Hydrology, Drainage Analysis, Flood Studies, and Complex Stormwater Litigation for Atlanta and the South East -

http://www.campbellcivil.com

 

[TenPenny]

One of the big reasons that doctors order tests is because they are available, and they'll get sued if they don't and something happens, even when they know the tests won't help the outcome.

The standard for determining tests used to be, 'what is the point? what will I do with the results, will it alter treatment in any way?' Now, the standard is, 'it's available, and the patient will complain if I don't order it, so I'd better order it'.

Like going to the doctor for a cold, what's the point? It achieves nothing, but yet, many people do it.

 

[cranky108]

Why not require every medical plan to have a $2000 deductable. That way everyone must fork over the first $2000 cost and might just think a little about how it gets spent.

So a hip replacement cost is $2000 out of pocket, the same as the MRI. However if the doctor recommends you see a specalist for an in-grown nail, you might think twice as it's out of pocket for you.

 

[KENAT]

Sure, you gonna bump up minimum wage so folks starting out in menial jobs at least have a fighting chance of affording that $2000 deductible?

Posting guidelines faq731-376

http://eng-tips.com/market.cfm?

(probably not aimed specifically at you)
What is Engineering anyway: faq1088-1484​

 

[beej67]

Or you just move everyone to very high deductable plans with pretax Health Savings Accounts, to incentivize everyone to keep their costs down since it's their own money that's paying for most of what they buy...

...but...

...Plans like that were specifically made illegal by Obamacare. Specifically singled out to be made illegal. Because those people "weren't sharing enough cost." Translation: those plans didn't drive up the cost of healthcare enough.

Seriously.





Hydrology, Drainage Analysis, Flood Studies, and Complex Stormwater Litigation for Atlanta and the South East -

http://www.campbellcivil.com

 

[glass99]

America is not Denmark - Capitalism is heart felt culturally for the 300 million immigrant strivers and their descendants that populate the country. America resisted the nationalization of the telephone system in the 20th century - how much did that contribute to the subsequent communications and internet revolution in the 80's and 90's? Norway has state control of oil extraction, but the American economy is presently being powered to a significant extent by shale oil and gas. Pretty much every big success that America has had including being the world's only superpower, has been on the back of its capitalist economy. Its fair to say that nationalizing 18% of the economy feels weird.

 

[CELinOttawa]

I don't think you need to nationalise. Canadian health care is nearly entirely delivered by private sector companies...

 

[CELinOttawa]

@Hokkie: Over a number of years, it has slowly become my honest opinion. I should, however, have been much more politically correct about it. It was, as you say, far too strong.

You all deserve better, and I apologise.

 

[IRstuff]

"Plans like that were specifically made illegal by Obamacare."

Huh? One of my company's plans is a high-deductible with HSA.

But, an HSA's advantage is pre-tax, but if you aren't going to owe taxes, that's sort of irrelevant, so if you couldn't afford $2000 for medical expenses and owe little in taxes, an HSA-based plane is not particularly useful.

TTFN
faq731-376

Need help writing a question or understanding a reply? forum1529

Of course I can. I can do anything. I can do absolutely anything. I'm an expert!

 

[glass99]

IRStuff: More practical question: What is the deductible on your high deductible plan? Do you know how much the policy costs? Is it a decent coverage network?

 

[SomptingGuy]

I have to admit that I let out a big sigh of relief when my time living in USA was done and I no longer had to think about health insurance: what was covered, what was not, how sick I could get and stay solvent.

- Steve

 

[IRstuff]

OK, the plan works out to $2084 per year, with a total of $6000 deductible and reimburses about 90% of costs above deductible, with and out of pocket maximum of $12000, but the company contributes $3000 to the HSA. Still, it's not exactly affordable for the unwashed masses. While it would probably make me look at the costs, the biggest costs like ER are probably mot shoppable; I mean, who's going to be trying to shop for the cheapest ER when their kid is can't breathe and is so dehydrated that they can't even get an IV in?

TTFN
faq731-376

Need help writing a question or understanding a reply? forum1529

Of course I can. I can do anything. I can do absolutely anything. I'm an expert!

 

[beej67]

Well, I'll eat crow on that one. I had a friend who was wailing about the horrible changes Obamacare was going to make to his HSA, but reading about them it seems that the changes weren't that huge. The family HSA contribution cap is still around $6k, which is what it was in 2009.



Hydrology, Drainage Analysis, Flood Studies, and Complex Stormwater Litigation for Atlanta and the South East -

http://www.campbellcivil.com

 

[TenPenny]

I find that's the case with a lot of the complaining about, and praise of, Obamacare. It's based on nothing approaching actual facts.

I guess that makes for the best political commentary, though.

 

[IRstuff]

A slight error, the family deductible is $4000, with the single coverage being $2000, which I added together, because of the odd wording in the brochure

TTFN
faq731-376

Need help writing a question or understanding a reply? forum1529

Of course I can. I can do anything. I can do absolutely anything. I'm an expert!

 

[glass99]

IRStuff: I assume you are not on minimum wage - how does the high deductible + HSA combination work for you in the real world? I always worry about putting money into the HSA which I won't use and losing it.

TenPenny: the thing about Obamacare is that it is pretty much exactly what I would have expected the Republicans to have done had they reformed healthcare. It retains a fully private system and empowers individuals to get insurance independent of their employers. No corporation was harmed in the making of this bill! Its exactly what I would have expected from a Dick Cheney with his down home on the ranch / look a man in the eye before you shoot him / Ayn Rand ethics.

 

[beej67]

I thought money in the HSA carried over from year to year if you didn't use it, and only the FSA money is truly "lost."

Is that not how it works?

Hydrology, Drainage Analysis, Flood Studies, and Complex Stormwater Litigation for Atlanta and the South East -

http://www.campbellcivil.com

 

[moltenmetal]

glass99: capitalism is so heart-felt in the US that they try to apply it to stuff to which it CANNOT apply. Is this love of capitalism sensible and rational, or has it become ideological?

If you don't want people to die of causes which can easily be treated by medicine, and you are unwilling to let them die merely because they lack the money to pay for that medical care, then you have de facto rendered basic health care a human right rather than a commodity. You cannot trade human rights. A market cannot assign them a fair trade value.

It is also a mistake, proven easily by measurement and comparison, that the private sector always delivers goods and services for less total cost than the public sector can. Proof is the % GDP expenditure difference to provide health care to Canadians and Americans. Outcomes are similar- costs are VERY different, and the reason is simply this: the public system, though imperfect, is far more efficient than the mix of public/private you have in the US. Not by a little- by 7% of GDP.

The question really isn't one of government takeover of 17% of your GDP- it's whether or not you want to continue to spend 7% of your GDP to enrich people in return for NOTHING. Your country, your choice.

You need not fear, because in reality you have no choice. That 7% of GDP wields more power than the US military which in its entirety costs less than 5% of GDP. Those parasites are in your bloodstream and there's no drug which will remove them.

 

[rconnor]

If you don't want people to die of causes which can easily be treated by medicine, and you are unwilling to let them die merely because they lack the money to pay for that medical care, then you have de facto rendered basic health care a human right rather than a commodity. You cannot trade human rights. A market cannot assign them a fair trade value.

molten, I wish I could give you more than 1 star for this.