How To Apply for a Lower Position

[Beggar]

Greetings, all.

As some might know, I'm in the job market again. Although I've got nearly 15 years under my belt, I've never been in one industry long enough to be an expert at anything. This leads to my present quandry.

I've applied for an ME position at a local company that also has a posting for a Senior ME. I applied for the lower position because I don't have some of the specific skills required by the senior position. On the other hand, I do have a fair amount of PM experience and other general engineering experience.

They contacted me yesterday for a phone interview this morning and they said, "Thanks for applying for the Sr. ME position."

So, how do I deal with this tactfully? I'd prefer not to spend any time pointing out my deficiencies but I'm afraid that if they evaluate me against the requirements of the Sr. position, I won't get past the HR screener with whom I'll be speaking.

I've had a couple of thoughts:

1) The senior position may be on track for relocation in the next few months. I could use that to defer back into the junior position.

2) I could be honest and say that I have no professional experience in a couple of those areas but did study it in school (which is true).

3) I could just down play the deficiencies and focus on the positives. I can at least speak intelligently about the areas where I'm weak.

4) I could ask whether my resume has undergone a technical review. If so, it's probably less of an issue.

I believe I can do the job and can come up to speed on the areas where I'm weak because I did pretty well in those courses in college. Of course, I still don't have any practical experience in those areas.

Any thoughts?

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[wes616]

Beggar,

My thought is that if in their eyes, were not qualified for the Sr position, then you whould not have gotten the phone interview to begin with.

I'll bet every one on this board who has a few years under their belt (and has changed jobs) has been in a similar situation. Look at it like you are "moving up". Yes, you may not be as experienced as someone making a "lateral move" into the exact same posiiton, but you are brining a new set of tools and experiences to the table. Maybe they see something on your resume that they didn't even know they were looking for when they wrote the job desc.

Good luck man!

Wes C.
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No trees were killed in the sending of this message, but a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.

 

[VeryPicky]

Dear Beggar.

You sound like a modest person, who knows his (her) strengths and weaknesses.
You should ask yourself a question: do you want to relocate?
If you do take the senior position and work to bridge any gaps (if any) between where you are and where the position is.
If you don't want the senior position because of relocation, that is more difficult since the company clearly has classified you in that senior position range. They might see you as overqualified for junior position, which in their view maybe even worse than undequalified.

Don't make a istake setting for a lower position because you don't believe you can do more. WHat if your perception of the senior position is incorrect and you are the perfect candidate?

Hope it helps. I would be very curios to see where you went from here.
Good luck.

Putting Human Factor Back in Engineering

 

[IRstuff]

As with most job postings, much of what's written is boiler-plated, so I wouldn't worry too much about matching the requirements exactly.

Often, we might see a resume that contains some interesting, yet relevant, experience that trumps the stuff we put on the job posting.

So, I would not worry about the qualifications too much and deal only with the relocation issue. Whatever they saw might trump that as well.

TTFN

 

[KENAT]

You could always do what I've done and just say that if they didn't find you suitable for the senior position you may be interested in the junior position and would appreciate their consideration.

However, in second thoughts, I didn't get those jobs so maybe not!

All the best,

Ken

 

[qassure]

Have confidence in you. What is life with out chalenges. You should go for, and only go for Sr. ME position only. Take it up and let's see what comes.

My best wishes
Qassure

 

[Beggar]

Interview's in 25 minutes -- I'm going to swing for the fences and see what happens.

I'm just hoping to get a shot at talking to their engineering types.

--------------------
How much do YOU owe?

http://www.brillig.com/debt_clock/

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[wes616]

Good luck Beggar! Let us know how it goes!

Wes C.
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No trees were killed in the sending of this message, but a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.

 

[Beggar]

Bad news / Good news:

The bad is that they don't think I'm suited for the senior position. I can't say I disagree with them.

The good news is that they think I might be suited for a mid-level position so they're going to refer me to somebody else.

It's still a possibility, I think.

--------------------
How much do YOU owe?

http://www.brillig.com/debt_clock/

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[wes616]

Well that's good news!

Wes C.
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No trees were killed in the sending of this message, but a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.

 

[ctopher]

Great news! Wish you luck!

Chris
Systems Analyst, I.S.
SolidWorks 06 4.1/PDMWorks 06
AutoCAD 06
ctopher's home (updated 06-21-06)

 

[Beggar]

Thanks, guys.

I must really want the position because I felt really uptight during the conversation and even stammered a bit (not typical behavior).

I checked my BP right afterwards and it was 135/85 instead of my normal 120/62.

Ugh, I HATE job hunting.

--------------------
How much do YOU owe?

http://www.brillig.com/debt_clock/

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[Heckler]

Beggar,

Congrats on passing the HR test. In your next interview will you be speaking to the engineering manager or another HR rep? I have a feeling I know what company this is ...underwater exploration?

Best Regards,

Heckler
Sr. Mechanical Engineer
SW2005 SP 5.0 & Pro/E 2001
Dell Precision 370
P4 3.6 GHz, 1GB RAM
XP Pro SP2.0
NVIDIA Quadro FX 1400
o
_`\(,_
(_)/ (_)

Never argue with an idiot. They'll bring you down to their level and beat you with experience every time.

 

[l3city]

Beggar, whish you get this or other job you want soon! The Eng-Tips community is on this with you!! Keep the hard work, and always be positive!! Regards

 

[Beggar]

Heckler, the next person is the recruiter (HR) for the other position. I suspect you've figured it out ;-)


--------------------
How much do YOU owe?

http://www.brillig.com/debt_clock/

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[ctopher]

Beggar,
I hope the pay is enough for you to pay your share of debt.
$28,377.67


Chris
Systems Analyst, I.S.
SolidWorks 06 4.1/PDMWorks 06
AutoCAD 06
ctopher's home (updated 06-21-06)

 

[Beggar]

Funny you say that, Chris.

I actually sent a letter to Ellen Tauscher offering to pay off the shares of myself, my wife, and my daughter in exchange for a release from responsibility for any further debt.

The automated form letter response just blamed Bush. Gee, Ellen, you didn't *vote* for any of those appropriations, did you???

I was at least hoping for a humorous response from some tired staffer. Nope, just a computerized letter that keyed in on "national debt" and regurgitated the canned response from some database.

--------------------
How much do YOU owe?

http://www.brillig.com/debt_clock/

--------------------

 

[Heckler]

Beggar,

I went through the mill sometime back. They were set on the SrME having direct supervising experience which I didn't but instead I had a lot of peer mentoring & PM experience. Then they went on to insist specific CAE FEA (I will leave out the name) experience but couldn't see the value of my other CAE FEA package experience along with being able to do hand calcs. I went into specific detail on my FEA experience but they just couldn't see the big picture.

I decided based on there hiring practices that I wouldn't work there if they offered me the job and they were the ones that contacted me. Companies that can not see the value of similiar experience especially over a software package that can be learned and not see core engineering skills is again....extremely shortsighted on there part.

But I wish you the best of luck.

 

[Beggar]

Interesting, Heckler.

I had precisely the same experience regarding both supervisory experience and that specific FEA package. I pointed to my graduate FE course, a few projects along the way, and the ability to calculate many things by hand. I actually do have direct supervisory experience but it wasn't enough.

I'd probably go for it if they wanted me and we could agree on satisfactory compensation. Their product line looks pretty cool for an ME. And, they're only 10 minutes from my house which would be a nice change from the 80 mile drives to Nevada County. We were already hoping to start my kid in school there next year and working in the city would probably help with an interdistrict transfer.

At this point, though, there are still several hoops to jump through so I'm being a bit (OK, a lot) premature.

Did you pull out at the outset or did you go on to meet the technical guys? Did it seem like a decent group of people.


--------------------
How much do YOU owe?

http://www.brillig.com/debt_clock/

--------------------

 

[Heckler]

What frustrated me the most was the HR rep had a cook book list of things to check but could not understand the items on the list or items within my skillset that was extremely close. So it ended up being a frustrating phone interview. When someone believes that this CAE FEA software is the end-all to FEA then we all need to take a step back to think for one moment how engineers fifty years ago were able to design lets say the Golden Gate Bridge.....ah ha...hand calculation!

My idea of a phone interview should not dig into that much detail especially since the HR rep was not technical. I ended having a phone interview with the engineering manager and I knew right then it wouldn't go any further. I was right and four days later got "the call".

I should mention I have a friend that works there so I had some inside information on particular personalities so maybe that's what pushed me over the edge with regards to the narrow-minded-thinking.