How to Get Green Engineers Some Horse Sense? 18

[KernOily]

I have green engineers on my staff that don't know which end of a hammer to apply to the nail.

Without sounding too much like an old furt curmudgeon (I ain't THAT old), the new crop of engineers has me worried. They can run a computer (well, mostly) but have zero horse sense, no hands-on manual skills, feel for the way things go together, and know nothing about the practical side of machines or processes. I can't send one of them out to the field to have an intelligent conversation with a welder or a crew lead.

30 years ago, kids built models, had Erector sets and Lincoln Logs, made jewelry, rode mini bikes and go-carts, did weavings and sewing, banged boards together to make a treehouse, and just generally tore stuff down and put it back together again. In so doing one learns invaluable lessons that you just can't learn any other way.

I really think the primary and secondary educational strategy in this country over the last 25 years is partly to blame. The "everyone must go to college to support the upcoming future service economy" is now coming home to roost and kicking us in the shorts.

I am really tempted to start having them do the oil changes on my truck. That might be a start.

I'd love to hear what you guys are doing about this. Might be a lost cause. Save me from my curmudgeonly malaise. Pete

 

[squeeky]

There was a question on where the money is to come from for the training. In South Africa every company has to be registered with a SETA specificity that industry. Here is a simplified explanation. For every employee, they have to pay a minimal amount, 0.5% of salary. This is then held in a SETA fund. Companies can then send staff on approved training courses. They then claim the money back. PROBLEM each SETA now sits with a lot of money doing nothing. Next, each SETA has employees that are friends or relitives (I do generalize here as the are some good ones). Companies claim the training money but it takes months, even years to be refunded, thus small companies who need the training but suffer with cash flow challenges, tend not to send people. Larger companies tend to run their own training or send management and accountants for expensive training where accommodation in fancy hotels is the greater part of the cost.

The universities have now started a pilot program where students who require practical training having completed their studies can be placed with willing companies and the SETA pays them a stipend. I have 3 slaves that follow me around. They have small projects and we have daily discussions. They accompany me on factory visits and presentations. We discuss every safety incident reported from the 16 entities. They learn a lot from these. Back to the money. These poor, fellows have now worked for 2 months without pay as there is a problem with getting the money out of the SETAs. One lives in a tin shack on the side of a hill next to an industrial area, which he rents as he does not come from this area. He walks great distances to catch cheap transport to work.

A good system destroyed by incompetence and bureaucracy.

 

[tbuelna]

squeeky-

You make some excellent points regarding the effort and expense to get a university engineering degree versus what you will earn as an entry level engineer during the first few years on the job. One young guy I worked with that just graduated from an Ivy League school with an MSEE told me that the highest paying job offers he received were from private investment firms, rather than from engineering companies.

 

[IRstuff]

Well, at least they don't have a psychology degree. The whole subject of ROI of college degrees is a pretty popular subject every fall/winter. Leaving school with $200k of debt, but facing a lifetime of $35k jobs is a poor situation. Some people just don't seem to grasp the concept that you need to get an employable college degree, and certainly not any old PhD (Party hardy & Drinking)

TTFN
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