Hythane or Hydrogen Conversion

[pigscanfly]

I'm looking for information on converting a CNG vehicle to run on either Hythane or hydrogen (internal combustion).

Questions:

1. What's involved in converting a CNG vehicle to run on Hythane and/or hydrogen? Can the fuels be used interchangeably?

2. What's the typical power and range reduction when converting from CNG to Hythane or hydrogen?

3. Can Hythane be dispensed from a standard CNG refueling station (assuming H2 available) or is custom equipment required?

Any contacts for Hythane and/or hydrogen conversions would be helpful too!

 

[harrisj]

What in the world is Hythane?

 

[pigscanfly]

Hythane® is CNG with a splash of hydrogen. It has been shown to lower NOx emissions in CNG vehicles.

 

[franzh]

pigscanfly:
There is a transit company near Palm Springs that is using Hythane in its CNG based buses with good results, from what they publish. Hythane can be stored in a CNG station, but H2 and CH4 have different characteristics when compressed, and since they are different specific gravities, they can settle over time if not moved around. Since H2 has a wide range of flammability, it can work with almost any CNG system, the problem is locating it.
H2 has its place in modern transportation, but in my opinion, we need to find a replacement for the IC engine first, its not the most efficient means of power, just the most popular.
Franz

 

[pigscanfly]

Where are the Palm Springs results published?

 

[franzh]

Pigs:
Try searching through:

http://www.sunline.org/

They are located in Thousand Palms, about 15 miles from Palm Springs.

Franz

 

[H2power]

Here are a few links of pickup trucks converted to use hydrogen enhanced compressed natural gas (HCNG). The concept is simmilar to hythane, just higher precentages of Hydrogen. Using higher percentages of hydrogen has definite emmsisions advantages.

http://www.nrgtech.com/Michelin.htm

http://avt.inel.gov/hydrogen/pdf/F150Hipercentreport.pdf

http://avt.inel.gov/hydrogen/pdf/F150Lowpercentreport.pdf

Also referance Sae paper 960858 and 961103.

 

[HydroScope]

Those U.S DOE on the F150's are anoying!!

they meantioned the factory standard HP and curb weight, but not after modifactions!! what HP after mod's did they acheive?? how far did they lean out the operation of the engines to acheive near no NOx for the 50/50 blend. DI port admission???

Generally speaking this would de-rate the BHP of engine, making a NOx per HP emission test much more sensible especially when dealing with a 3 ton beast of a truck. But they did use a supercharger so maybe there wasn't any significant reduction!!

That is the question!!

 

[SBBlue]

I may be wrong, but . . . .

Doesn't leaning out the fuel cause a lower power density?

And a lower power density means less hp when you need it -- like accelerating or going up a hill?

 

[HydroScope]

sorry was I not clear. . . that was my point exactly. . . . what power output did they acheive? one thing to reduce emissions another to reduce emission at same power and curb weight of vehicle. they did not state this!