Madrid or Barcelona? 1

[MedicineEng]

I have a remote possibility to move to a company with offices in Madrid and Barcelona and at this stage is up to me to choose in which city I want to work.
I've never lived in Spain, so it is difficult for me to evaluate a salary and conditions based on local living standards. As an exercise, let's say that I can close the deal at 55000Euros/year with no fringe benefits (car, house allowance, etc.). In Spain, health and retirement are state controlled, so I also don't need to "worry" about that.
For a family of 4 (2 young kids) is this salary sufficient to make a living? What is the living standard differences of these 2 cities? Which are the main advantages/disadvantages of the 2 locations? Any information would be helpful. Thanks in advance

 

[corus]

Don't be too sure that because health and retirement are state controlled for those who live in Spain and are Spanish means that any old Johnny foreigner (as they say in London) can hop off a train in Madrid and ask for a quick heart bypass and your weekly pension to see you to the weekend. I don't think it works like that, particularly if you're non-european.


corus

 

[SomptingGuy]

Another cautionary bit of advice is that the HR people at the company in Spain will not necessarily be clued up on the implications of a non EU citizen living and working in EU.

When I took a USA secondment, our HR dept were utterly hopeless. The Brits knew nothing about US tax; the Americans assumed I knew everything.

The ultimate bible for me was the USA version of this book. Given that this Spanish version has the same authors, it's probably really good too.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Living-Working-Spain-Survival-Handbooks/dp/190113041X

- Steve

 

[MedicineEng]

Thank you for your advices and maybe I was not clear enough, I am an EU citizen so there shouldn't be a problem.

 

[apsix]

Barcelona has the better climate; warmer in winter, not so hot in summer.

 

[epoisses]

and it has seafood... and Gaudi... I guess it is slightly more expensive than Madrid, but I have no actual data

Re medical, it depends if you have a Spanish contract. I am a foreigner working in France on a French contract. Like any French person, my family and I can fully benefit from the medical system (I pay through my nose for it as well).

55000 Euros/year I guess is more than the average European family with two kids earns, so it's certainly possible to "make a living", it all depends what your idea of living is. Don't expect to be able to buy a house as big as one you buy in the US! Rather look for an appartment in a decent neighbourhood not far from downtown so your wife can move around easily.

 

[epoisses]

sorry I just read in your 2nd post you're an EU citizen, where are you from?

 

[KENAT]

Based on what some spanish people told me when I visited Spain in the 90s, Madrid is nothing special.

So I'd lean toward Barcelona if the financials work out.

KENAT, probably the least qualified checker you'll ever meet...

 

[csd72]

I havent been to madrid, but you wont be dissapointed with barcelona.

I would definately agree with what someone said above about double checking what their HR people say. Do your research before you commit.

 

[MedicineEng]

epoisses:
I would rather not reveal my citizenship. Let's just say that I am an EU citizen that belongs to Schengen and Euro area, so for me to work and live in Spain doesn't create any "legal" issues.
Dear All:
Thank you for your replies. I still didn't make my decision yet, also the offer is still in the hypothesis field. I just wanted to gather all the information in order to when and if I go down to details with teh company I am able to to make an informed decision.
Since now I am living in China in order to relocate back to Europe I have to be the more informed possible, in order to avoid bad surprises. Saying that, my heart right now goes to Barcelona, but I am afraid that I am being driven by a
"tourist" point of view and sometimes the tourist view can paint pink a situation that is black.

 

[josephv]

Any chance you can visit both these cities before making a decision? Personally, I have been to both of them and think they are great, but they are quite different from each other.

 

[ajack1]

MedicineEng I think you will find Barcelona is in Catalonia and not in Spain, just ask the locals. ;-)

 

[MedicineEng]

Ahahaha, that one is good ajack1.

For 2 years in a row I spent holidays in Bilbao (Pais Basco), where they claim independence from Spain for many years, and in some bars they even refuse to serve you a beer if you speak Spanish with them. Only if you speak basque or, as it happened to me, they realize that you are not Spanish, then they serve you.

 

[gerhardl]

I would have tried to check if the EUR 55' was an acceptable level for my type of job and experience in Spain. Any Spanish union or association for engineers you could ask?

(Knowledge and use of (several ?) languages could have an additional value?)

 

[Neubaten]

I'm spanish myself, well, to be exact, I'm basque, from Bilbao.

You'll be doing more than fine with 55k IF you find a housing solution not too expensive. The problem here is rent/buy a house. Probably you'll have to forget the idea of an american house w/ garage and front garden. You'll probably live in an apartment or a flat. Both Barcelona and Madrid are expensive. You'll probably pay 700 €/month for a 80m2 apartment.

You'll have no medical expenses, I assure you.

Public transport is nice in Barcelona (NOT in Madrid), and in both places is cheap. Driving is not an option in both places, unless you're a masochist. Public transport is not considered for hobos or criminals, like in the US, even executives here go to work by train.

Barcelona is beautiful, so is Madrid in certain places, especially downtown. In Madrid you'll get a taste of the ancient Imperial Spain, with the king's buildings and palaces and all that stuff, in Barcelona you'll find the modern Spain, Gaudi and Calatrava, etc...

Madrid is a little more "corrupt", as every capital, a lot of not-so-nice looking people in the streets and people from around the world, it's dirtier and busier.

And, going back to your pay, be sure to check it's free of taxes. If you pay taxes in Spain you'll have to multiply that number by a factor of 0.8 more or less.

Still, I make 32k € free of taxes, as a junior engineer in an aeronautics company, and seniors here make more or less the same as you, so you are going to be a lucky bastard.

Also, take note: if you live in Barcelona you have very very close nice beaches at summer and nice mountains for snow sports at winter.

 

[MedicineEng]

Neubaten:
Thanks a lot for your reply. It was quite helpful. Unfortunately, the 55K are not free of taxes, so the net salary will be lower.
My idea of housing is not American style, since I am European and I always lived in appartments, so not big deal, providing that the appartment is ok. In fact, housing it is the factor that I am most worried about. I've been in some sites and the appartments that I think would fit my family are always over 1000 Euros/month, which is quite a big portion of net salary.

 

[amalric]

Hi.

i am spanish, living in Valencia (3rd city of spain now)

I have worked in madrid and i prefer Barcelona as a city, but there is an important thing you must take into account, LOTS and i mean lots of people in Barcelona speak Catalan, the local tv is in catalan, (not the national ones, only regional level). You can go on and live there speaking only spanish but it would be like living in flemish belgium spealing french.

Is not that people will not speak to you in catalan and refuse to speak in spanish, is that they are use to mix both languages, so it is quite hard for a foreigner.

IMHO i will choose Barcelona, but taking this into account.


Also there is not a big market for house renting in spain as here the rule is to buy it. but as the housing market is crashing now you will find good prices for flats.

Hope it helps.
Railway Engineer