Making someone else's product

[berkshire]

For the past 10 years I have been maintaining and repairing traction motor resistors, for light rail cars, mostly by cannibalisation.
The maker a European company does not offer this particular part anymore. I am now getting to the stage where repairable parts are getting scarce.
My customer is now asking me, if I can fabricate these parts from scratch. Since this is Somebody Else's product, I do not feel comfortable just making them without some kind of written permission.
My customer is telling me, that the reason the manufacturer, will not, sell these parts to them, is that they are trying to sell them newer units ( Complete rail cars.) and that they are not likely to give me permission to fabricate an obsolete part.
What are the guidelines here? Make them until I get a cease and desist order, or not even try?
I see this kind of thing done with aftermarket suppliers in the automobile industry with older cars. Do they get permission?
B.E.

 

[pierdesign]

Reverse engineering components is fairly common practice. Manufacturing and selling reverse engineered components is a legal grey area. In the automotive examples discussed, there often is overt complicity or planned ignorance by said automotive companies and their tier suppliers.

Doing so using the OEM's own documentation where it contains disclaimer on not using or copying without notification or authorization is prosecutable, under which statute(s) varies by jurisdiction. Often it is copyright law that applies.

In the case discussed, I believe very simply a licence is needed from the OEM. Companies are not benevolent charities, however due to passage of time and/or 'abandonment' they might give authorization gratis, however expect to sign legal indemnification contract.

 

[berkshire]

Pierdesign,
Thank you for that opinion.
Right now I have the customers legal department checking the original contract, to see if it contains language, giving them the right to manufacture or cause to be manufactured, parts the original supplier is unwilling or unable to provide.
B.E.

 

[KENAT]

Here's an idea, can you stretch the definition of repairing/refurbishing the old parts?

Basically make a new part but use a couple of components or something from an old one?

KENAT, probably the least qualified checker you'll ever meet...

 

[smcadman]

What we have done in similar situations is make the same part but change it by 10% so we get around trademark infringement. I have heard others say they change it by 20%.

Many times you can modify the shape a bit so it fits and functions the same but visually there is a difference between the two.



Flores

 

[MortenA]

dosnt patents normally expire after 25 year? It sounds as if these pars are much older.

Actually if there was a patent (and its expired) then you should be able to get the drawings at the patent office.

Best regards

Morten

 

[cedarbluffranch]

Reverse engineering parts, manufacturing them, and selling them is not a legal gray area. It's legal and acceptable. I worked in the industry and had a number of designs approved by the FAA as reverse engineered parts.

 

[cedarbluffranch]

To append my previous post, I think the OP will need to receive the OEM's approval to start selling the products. While reverse engineering is ethical, legal, and frequently done, the OP has the proprietary information from the OEM at his disposal. He would be hard pressed to prove that he was able to start making and selling the products without using any proprietary knowledge.

In the OP's case, I think that the only way to do what he wants cleanly and without risk of being liable is to receive the OEM permission.

 

[MacGyverS2000]

Reverse engineering parts, manufacturing them, and selling them is not a legal gray area. It's legal and acceptable.

Let's be clear... this is heavily dependent upon the industry. I'm sure Apple would take great exception to someone reverse-engineering one of their iPods to manufacture copies. Hell, they just applied for a patent to prevent people from taking their iPod connection in Nike shoes and putting them in some other garment.

Dan - Owner

http://www.Hi-TecDesigns.com

 

[cedarbluffranch]

Apple has numerous patents (and copyrights) to protect their IP.

Without these protections, we'd all be free to reverse engineer and copy their product. Our US laws provide no protection beyond patents, trademarks, and copyrights.