Multiple Hinges in Assembly 2

[ssmithdigilab]

Is there a way to mate two hinges to a door and frame in such a way that when the door swings, the second hinge follows?

For your reference the two hinges are two separate sub-assemblies that are essentially mirror images of each other. I set the sub-assemblies to flexible and mated the first hinge to both the door and the frame. However, Solidworks won't let me mate the second hinge to both the door and the frame. It always tells me that it is overdefined. So I end up solely mating the second hinge to one or the other.

When I move the door one hinge works perfectly, but the second hinge doesn't turn and either ends up interfering with the door or the frame (depending on which one it is mated to).

I've searched pretty extensively on this site for info about hinges and can't find any answers to this particular problem. It seems to me that it would be pretty common to have more than one hinge on a door and that you would need to be able to mate all hinges to both the frame and the door for the motion to be portrayed correctly.

 

[Eltron]

Rather than having the door be completely free to move sometimes it's better to run it with configurations and / or angle mates.

Dan

http://www.eltronresearch.com

Dan's Blog

 

[JMirisola]

Are they separate or are is one actually a mirror of the other? If mirrored, break the link between them for starters.
Next, have you tried mating hinge face to hinge face? Assuming that the door and frame are planar and parallel, you should be able to simply do a coincident mate between the corresponding hinge faces, then simply set the distance.
Those are just a couple of ideas. Without seeing the assembly, it's a bit difficult to fully diagnose what's going on.

Jeff Mirisola, CSWP
Design Manager/Senior Designer
M9 Defense
My Blog

 

[ssmithdigilab]

They are actually two separate assemblies.

I have found a work around to make it appear to function correctly. I assembled each hinge sub-assembly so that the plate that mounts to the frame is mated coincidentally to the 3 planes of the sub-assembly. I then created a hinge mate for the pin plate in each. I then assembled the 1st hinge in the top level by mating it to both the door and the frame. I mate the second hinge to just the door and it appears to function correctly, as the plate that is supposed to be mounted to the hinge doesn't move when the door is opened.

It just doesn't make any sense that you can't mate both hinges to both the door and the frame when they are both "flexible". Maybe they will fix this issue in future versions.

 

[JMirisola]

I can't think of why you're having the problems you're having. I created a door assembly, albeit it ugly, with flexible hinges, and it all works just fine. I attached it. Hopefully it helps you out.

Jeff Mirisola, CSWP
Design Manager/Senior Designer
M9 Defense
My Blog

 

[ssmithdigilab]

I can't open those files. When I try to open the files I get an error message stating, "Cannot open ... Future Version:.

I'm on Solidworks 2009 SP3.0. Can you save them to that version?

 

[JMirisola]

No, you can't directly save to older versions. I could save it as a neutral file format, but it would lose the mates.
Hopefully someone with '09 will come along and help out.

Jeff Mirisola, CSWP
Design Manager/Senior Designer
M9 Defense
My Blog

 

[ssmithdigilab]

Oh yeah, that's right. Funny how in AutoCAD you could always save to lower versions...

Anyways, were you able to mate both hinges to both the door and the frame? Maybe that's a problem in 2009 that's been fixed in later versions.

Attached is a simplified version of what I'm talking about. I believe you can open old versions in newer versions, but not the other way around. I created two configurations in this assembly.

In the default configuration, "2nd Hinge Assembled to Frame", Hinge: B0014014 is mounted to the Frame: B0014012. When you rotate the door, the hinge doesn't move. When I try to mate the rotating component of the hinge to the door, I get the error I previously mentioned.

The other configuration, "2nd Hinge Assembled to Door" has the rotating component of B0014014 assembled to the door. This is a representation of my workaround. When you rotate the door, the rotating component of the hinge rotates and the other part stays stationary, even though it's not mated to the frame.

I would prefer to have the 2nd hinge actually mated to the door and the frame like it would be in real life.

 

[JMirisola]

The hinge assemblies are in the folder, but not the hinge parts. Can you upload just the hinge parts?

Jeff Mirisola, CSWP
Design Manager/Senior Designer
M9 Defense
My Blog

 

[Eltron]

You should do a pack-and-go of your assembly. I am having issues opening this one.

Dan

http://www.eltronresearch.com

Dan's Blog

 

[ssmithdigilab]

Sorry about that. Everything's in there this time.

 

[rgrayclamps]

Hi, ssmithdigilab:

I tried 3-hinge sub-asemblies (flex). I had no issues. I used SW2008 sp 3.1.

Best regards,

Alex

 

[JMirisola]

Ok, got it.
On one of the hinge sub-assemblies, delete the hinge mate and add a concentric and a coincident mate and the upper assembly should be just fine. I'm not sure why, but SolidWorks doesn't seem to be able to handle having both hinges with hinge mates. A bit of a shortcoming and worth sending in to your VAR in my opinion.

Also, for the record, I don't know of a single 3D CAD program that has the ability to save as a previous version including Inventor.

Jeff Mirisola, CSWP
Design Manager/Senior Designer
M9 Defense
My Blog

 

[CorBlimeyLimey]

Jeff,

Only the ones that put the customers convenience before the almighty dollar. I don't know of any either.

 

[ssmithdigilab]

JMirisola, when you do that are you able to mate the 2nd hinge to both the frame and the door? I tried what you said and initially it seemed like it worked, but then when I went to save it I got all the yellow triangles on my mates and the "no solution found" message.

 

[JMirisola]

Yes, I was able to mate to both. My steps:

1. Bring the frame into the assembly so that it's the fixed part.

2. Bring in the hinges and door.

3. Mate the hinges to the frame with two concentric mates and one coincidence mate.

4. Mate the door to one hinge with two concentric mates and one coincidence mate.

5. Mate the door to the other hinge with a parallel mate.

Jeff Mirisola, CSWP
Design Manager/Senior Designer
M9 Defense
My Blog

 

[ssmithdigilab]

Alright, that worked. Don't know what was going wrong the last time, but this time I was able to save it without a problem. I even used a coincident mate instead of a parallel mate and that worked, as well.

There are a couple of things that bug me about doing it this way. One of the hinge assemblies has to be left under-defined. I'm kind of fixated on fully defining every component in my assemblies. The other thing is that if you were to use the same hinge part twice, you would need 2 configurations of the hinge - one with the hinge mate, the other with the concentric and coincident mates.

Oh well, guess I'll just have to deal with those things until this problem is addressed.

Thanks a lot for everyone's help, particularly Jmirisola. Did you get any work done today?

 

[AnnaWood]

A star for Jeff for being so helpful to ssmithdigilab to get his problem solved.

Cheers,

Anna Wood
Core i7 EE965, FirePro V8700, 12 Gb RAM, OCZ Vertex 120 Gb SSD, Dell 3008WFP 30" Monitor
SW2010 SP2.1, Windows 7 x64

http://www.solidmuse.com

http://www.phxswug.com

 

I have the same problem. I have an access door that hinges out of the way. Everything goes good until I add a Limit Angle Mate. I was able to open the example files above and noticed that it doesn't have a limit mate. You can freely rotate the door 360 deg.

 

[JMirisola]

Where are you assigning the limit mate, in the upper level assembly or hinge assembly? I've successfully had limit mates in lower level assembly, but angle mates tend to be very tempermental.

Jeff Mirisola, CSWP
Design Manager/Senior Designer
M9 Defense
My Blog