Need help estimating project completion time

[CEmonkee]

I have been doing a few lateral wind/seismic analyses on residential wood-frame construction projects. I usually quote the client an estimated fee based on my hourly rate and how much time I think it will take to complete the project (this estimate includes calculations and in some cases structural drawings). In most cases I underestimate the project time to completion - I don't know if I'm just a slow worker or not good at estimating how much time is required for a project.

Does anyone have a general rule of thumb I could employ for these time estimates? For example, let's say I will be working on the design for a 3000 SF wood-frame building (2 stories) in a high seismic/wind area. How long does something like that generally take if it includes doing the loads analysis and the structural drawing sheets (foundation plan, shearwall plan, framing plan, misc. details)? I know a person's level of experience, etc. will be a factor in the amount of time a project takes to complete - mainly I'm just looking for ballpark figures.

Also, do any of you base your cost estimates on the square footage of the structure? If so, could you give me a range of reasonable rates?

Thanks for your help!

 

[kslee1000]

You shall estabilish a data bank for past works you have worked on. From that, you can compare the level of complexity of the future works and quote accordingly. Sort your efforts for different level of calculations, and time for drafting (per sheet) will help. Don't forget to set ample "goofy time" for something unforeseen.

 

[CEmonkee]

Hi kslee1000 - thanks for your reply. Your advice sounds good, however my problem is that I don't really have a vast database of past projects to use for number crunching. Years ago I worked under a structural engineer - I was just one cog in the office machine, doing the calcs. I didn't set the prices for clients or get involved in the drafting end of it. Now that I'm on my own, I'm doing it all (calcs, drafting, as well as office manager and accountant). I was hoping that there would be some "formula" that could be applied when estimating a project's time to completion - e.g. if it's 3000 square feet, 2-stories, wood-frame construction, it will take approximately XX hours. Until I get more projects to compare new jobs against, I'm kind of just guessing. I'd like to eliminate some of that guess-work if possible.

If there are any structural guys out there that do this type of work on a regular basis - I'm looking for ballpark numbers for typical projects (like the one I described above) - something to give me an idea if I'm way off base in my estimates.

Thanks!

 

[RVSWA]

First thing, I've never seen a good correlation between square footage and design time. Irregularities, number of wall lines and stories all have a greater impact on the amount of work required to do the design. Detailing and drafting time should have a somewhat linear following to design time. Experience will sharpen your skills and even then you'll occasionally find yourself working for less than your targeted hourly rate.

 

[kslee1000]

Sorry coludn't provide you more specific information, since it is not the field of my practice - heavy industrial.

However, as a suggestion if you are just getting start -
Break down the tasks involved as fine as possible and assign reasonale amount of time for each task, such as:

- Time for communication with client
- Time for setting up models
- Time for analysis and design
- Time for drafting (on per sheet base, note certain drawings need more time than the other, also depend on how many standard details available)
- Time for anticipated revisions
- Sure, time for coffee breaks

Good luck.

 

[kslee1000]

Obviously you will have to go through the learning curve by your own. Set a reasonable rate over the fine tuned time table, the worst case is to lose a little personal free time to make up your miss, which will be reduce drastically with time and experience (to be the boss of yourself).

 

[Cap07]

kslee1000 has some good suggestions. As you do more of these types of jobs, you'll have a better feel for estimating the time a job will take.

I've found that typically a 2 story woodframe project (lateral calcs & drawing sheets) takes me around 20 hours, give or take a few hours depending on the complexity of the structure. Maybe some of the others will weigh in with their project time estimates for a 2-story job. I know when you're first starting out, it's kind of nice to know how long it takes an "expert" to do a job - it gives you something to shoot for.

Cap

 

[McQSE]

I would start out quoting the client a high number to make sure you cover your time. If it makes you feel bad that you spend less time than you quoted, you could always tell the client this and cut the fee some.

I consider how long it would take me to do a job if everything works out perfect and then add about 25% more time for all the things that are going to come up.

I agree with the other posts. You have to do a number of jobs before you can get a good feel for a price. I can look at a plan and pick out things that are going to make things hard for me and things that will make it easy. Every time I see something that is going to make things hard, I increase the price.

I would also recommend you consider what the architect is getting paid (assuming there is an architect for the project). Around here they get anywhere from 4 to 8 percent of the construction cost. There are some posts on this site about what the structural fee should be based on a percentage of construction cost or percentage of the architectural fee. You should be able to ask the architect what their fee is or what the estimated construction cost is. I would get paid about half for some jobs if I based them on an hourly basis instead of percentage of construction.

 

[CEmonkee]

Thanks RVSWA, kslee1000, Cap07, and McQSE - I appreciate your input very much. Have any of you ever estimated your fee based on square footage (e.g. $0.75/SF)? If so, have you found that your final price correlated well with the time you spent on the project?

 

[NKT]

I have a lot of experience with the type of project you're describing; they've taken up at least half of my billed hours over the past five years. The following factors must be weighed to arrive at a fee:

1. How long the work will take (more on this below)
2. The value of the work to the client.
3. The client's schedule. A very aggressive timeline is a big red flag. ASK about the consequences of delays in delivery of the construction documents.
4. Your current workload and capacity to take on another project. Don't hesitate to give a realistic time estimate based on your workload, and explain it to the client.
5. The amount of risk and liability you are accepting according to the circumstances of the project.
6. The professional standard of care in your area.

The amount of analysis time depends heavily on the complexity of the structure, and can't be tied directly to size of the structure. The lateral system has the biggest influence - a lateral analysis of a regular structure (don't need to consider torsion effects) takes me about 1/3 as long as a highly irregular structure. My range of hours for a lateral and vertical analysis on a custom home is from about 24hrs to 100hrs, with the average falling around 40-45hrs (about $5k). My times may be a bit higher than others because my projects usually involve very steep lots, exciting soil conditions, retaining walls, walls-of-mostly-glass facing the ocean, etc., so scale my numbers down by 1/4 to 1/3 if you aren't dealing with a lot of foundation complexities.

These types of projects can be very challenging, both in complexity (underestimated by many) and in client relationships. A majority of the time, I'm working for a property owner who has minimal experience with engineers and doesn't understand the process. An important skill to develop is to be able to quickly and simply convey the complexity of what you're proposing to do for the client (in a 1/2 hour meeting). I've found that I can put a realistic fee and time line on a project and get nearly 100% of the jobs I propose on when I include one of these brief initial meetings. The success rate is MUCH lower when I just send a proposal, even if it's very competitively priced. You should make every effort to set up a face-to-face meeting to look over the plans when you receive the first call from the client (assuming the client already has a set of floor plans).

Lastly, don't be afraid of losing work. If you are good at what you do, more work will come through the door. Don't under-bid projects to try to fill up your schedule: clients don't value an under-priced contract; their perception of the project's value is usually set by your fee estimate.

 

[CEmonkee]

Thanks to everyone who posted on this - your help is much appreciated!!

 

[jheidt2543]

CEmonkee:

When I started out I set up a standard spreadsheet for pricing my proposals. I listed all of the project steps I could think of in the first column, then the second column was a low time estimate, the third column was a high time estimate. I could then put a range of times in for each step (pre-project meetings, review soils report, code review, design load developement, site investigation, structural frame design, foundation design, floor slab design, drawings, outline or full specifications, review submittals,reimbursables, farmed out work). Then, multiply the hours by my rate and add OH + Contingency.

At the bottom of the spreadsheet I compute a rough cost of
construction on a $/SF basis and look at a % of construction fee (Means and Dodge have ranges in their cost books). So, I end up with three looks at a fee for the work and then look at the job as NKT noted above.

This sounds like a lot of work for a small job BUT, once the spreadsheet is set up I can price a job in about 10-15 minutes knowing that I have thought about each aspect of what needs to be done no matter what the job size is.

Do I still run over time, YES! I know I can be rather slow figuring some things out, I just look at that as my education cost and move on. I also like to try to use a lump sum fee + reimbusables contract; there just seems to be less fighting over $ with the client.

 

[JLNJ]

The rub is that you can carefully put your time together, go over everything with your client, skinny it down to the bone, and then still be undercut by 1/2 by someone else.

 

[CEmonkee]

Hi jheidt2543 - thanks for your advice, it's much appreciated