NPFA 30 - Warehouse Fire protection schemes A,B,C,D,E - What sets the scheme

[therunningbruce]

Hopefully this is ok to ask.

I'm going through NPFA 30, to understand a proposal I've been given. (I will ask the vendor as well)..

(and sorry if its obvious).. On CH16, Im struggling to see what determines if I have Class II combustible
Class IIIA combustible , Class IIIB combustible - what scheme should be used. This is for validation of current and new proposed systems.

I can see a lots of info determine flow rates and other factors but I'm struggling to see the link from the chemicals to the schemes.

(Im blocked from the old fashoned read and print with our subscription..)..so im working through the painful screen print.. with search and reading..

 

[SprinklerDesigner2]

I have always asked the insurance carrier to tell me exactly what they want because there are so many variables.

I am not a chemist so I have others answer for me.

 

[cdafd]

So is one of your question

What is
Class II

Class IIIA

Class. IIIB????

If it is in the definition chapter

Than compare the SDS against the definition


Is that part of your question???

Is this a general question or a project you are working on???

 

[therunningbruce]

No sorry for confusion.. In the area I have Class II combustible, Class IIIA combustible , Class IIIB combustible stored in IBCs in racking.

So what determines what scheme of fire protection do i need NFPA 30 seems to have schemes from A,B,C,D,E... Im struggling to understand what sets the scheme.

thanks

 

[cdafd]

I do not have the book anymore

Have to look online

My thought would be, if you have all three in one area, you design to the Class II.

Let me try to look

How are you connected sprinkler designer, contractor, GC,,, other????

 

[UFT12]

So what determines what scheme of fire protection do i need NFPA 30 seems to have schemes from A,B,C,D,E... Im struggling to understand what sets the scheme.

Tables 16.5.2.5 through 16.5.2.17

 

[stookeyfpe]

Plastic or metal IBCs? That's the big question.

The Scheme is based on the liquid's classification, if the liquid water-miscible or not water-miscible, the container's material of construction and its volume. Scheme A-E are limited to rack storage. An IBC under NFPA 30 is not a Container because it's volume is < or = to 60 US Gallons. An IBC is its own package category that falls within the family of Portable Tanks, which have a volume > 60 US Gallons.

Because you are dealing with Intermediate Bulk Containers, Scheme A-E are not applicable. Based on the issues as I understand them, your only protection options in NFPA 30 (2019 ed.) are Table 16.5.2.1 through 16.5.2.4, based on the IBC storage method.

 

[therunningbruce]

Thankyou for the comments so far.. very helpful.

What do you do , if you have
> Metal clad IBCs
> Plastic IBCs
> drums
> class IIIA/B materials

can you mix up all 4 above in the same rack?

I'm getting feedback that NFPA 30 does not have have a design criteria to cover this mixture of materials is this correct or wrong?

 

[LCREP]

Try looking at Factory Mutual( FM) Data Sheet 7-29 IGNITABLE LIQUID STORAGE IN PORTABLE CONTAINERS

FM is a global property insurance carrier and may have more up to date protection criteria. They have a full scale fire protection testing facility. The data sheets are free.

As others have said reach out to the AHJ including the property insurance carrier. They may have fire protection specialists on staff that can help. As a retired property guy I loved being called before anything was done, lot easier and cheaper $$ then after the fact!

 

[therunningbruce]

Hi all.

thankyou for the advice below.. sorry these are basic questions

we are self insured so no AHJ involved.

what I dont understand with the schemes B... why is a floor / above the top layer of say IBCs drums required instead of a fire bulb with a heat shield

does the complete "floor" of heat shield ensure more fire monitors activate when a fire goes off? to make it a wider system.. for a wet deluge system

 

[LCREP]

I would hire a fire protection engineer to provide design information, review the fire protection plans, and review the installation to make sure it was installed as per the plans. Besides the sprinkler protection they need to perhaps look at liquid containment,etc. If the protection is not properly designed it goes bad in the 1st few minutes of the fire.

Who provides firefighting at the site? If an outside agency ie public fire department, they should be involved in the process.

 

[ProSafPlant1]

Agree that this looks complicated enough to get a professional involved. Even if "self-insured" there is likely a contact in the organization with access to loss control / fire protection specialists, usually the insurance / risk management department. As a risk control consultant, now retired, I would get questions like this passed on from my oil company risk manager clients all the time.

retired, technical library for sale on eBay -

https://www.ebay.com/usr/prosafbooks