ONE LUG Nutplate P/N BACN10JZ3 1

[sb1786]

Hello All,

I am making a design for an Airbus A310 and would need to install a nutplate P/N NAS1474 or NAS1473 description "NUT, SELF LOCKING, PLATE TWO LUG, CAP, FLOATING".

The issue in the design is that this type of nutplate doesn't satisfy my edge and fastener margin criteria.

I have been told that a "ONE LUG" nutplate exists and this would solve my problem.

After some research I came accross a nutplate P/N BACN10JZ3 which is apperently exactly what I am looking for.

Problems/Questions:

1- Anyone knows how or where I can find a spec sheet for nutplate P/N BACN10JZ3. (I know its a boeing nutplate)

2- Anyone knows if I can find an NAS/NASM/AN/MS equivalent to P/N BACN10JZ3.

3- Anyone know of a better alternate to nutplate P/N NAS1474 that is "ONE LUG" and for which I can get a spec sheet.


Thanks in advance

 

[KENAT]

http://www.usmilitaryfasteners.com/military-part-number-pictures.htm#naspics

any help?

KENAT,

Have you reminded yourself of faq731-376 recently, or taken a look at

http://eng-tips.com/market.cfm?

 

[KENAT]

thread16-223157

KENAT,

Have you reminded yourself of faq731-376 recently, or taken a look at

http://eng-tips.com/market.cfm?

 

[sb1786]

KENAT,

Thanks for the reply but this site you sent doesn't help me...

I am alot more interested in the specs of the nutplate P/N BACN10JZ3.

As I mentioned above, I have the specs for NAS1474 and wasn't able to find something similar to that with "One LUG". The only thing that comes really close is P/N NASM21061 (NUT, SELF-LOCKING, PLATE, ONE LUG, FLOATING, LOW HEIGHT, STEEL) but it is missing the CAP... and the CAP is a must.

 

[KENAT]

Sorry,

http://www.usmilitaryfasteners.com/docs/nas577-578-nas1042-1044.pdf

had what appeared to be a single lug nut plate NAS696-698 at the bottom which I thought might help you refine your search wrt your question 2.



KENAT,

Have you reminded yourself of faq731-376 recently, or taken a look at

http://eng-tips.com/market.cfm?

 

[WKTaylor]

CAUTION: The JZ is a sealed NP with a single wide flange... and reduced spacing side-by-side rivets. It is not a single narrow-lug NP with rivets in-line.

Regards, Wil Taylor

 

[sb1786]

KENAT,

Actually, NAS696-698 is not active anymore and refers you to MS21061 series which in turn refers you to NASM21061...
This is exactly what I'm looking for but with a CAP so unfortunatly this P/N is no good.


Wil,

I know about the JZ criteria.

My need is for a nutplate with wivets being on one side of the flange as for NAS696-698 series and BACN10JZ.


Thanks to both of you.

Has anyone found BACN10JZ data sheet?

 

[WKTaylor]

PolySim...

Go-To

http://www.spstech.com/aero/prod_lit/esna_catalog.pdf

and check-out the...

TA2507
ANCHOR, FLOATING, CORNER,
CAPPED, BASE SEAL
10-32 thru 5/16-24 to 250°F

Regards, Wil Taylor

 

[sb1786]

Wil,

Thanks this is great and exactly the type of nut I am looking for. I am still however unable to get a full spec on this fastener. I tried the net, sps website but no luck.

You have any idea where I can find TA specs. BTW what are TA specs. I need this so I can also insert the nutplate in my drawing.

Thanks

 

[WKTaylor]

Call SPS and ask!

SPS Technologies
301 Highland Avenue
Jenkintown, PA 19046

Phone: 215-572-3000
Fax: 215-572-3193
E-mail: aeromktg@spstech.com



Regards, Wil Taylor

 

[KENAT]

For additional information on ESNA parts and other SPS
aerospace fasteners and precision components, please
call our customer service representatives in our
Jenkintown, PA facility. Phone: 215-572-3000.
Fax: 215-572-3193.

From the link wktaylor gave, 2nd page, under mission statement.

As convenient as the web is, sometimes we have to resort to older forms of communication


KENAT,

Have you reminded yourself of faq731-376 recently, or taken a look at

http://eng-tips.com/market.cfm?

 

[sb1786]

Kenat, Wil,

I found all the info needed for SPS fastners here:

http://www.spstech.com/aero/fastenerfinder/results.jsp

This is a great tool.

Thanks Guys!

 

[thruthefence]

Didn't the board work great in this particular instance?For what it's worth, I'd like to compliment everyone involved.

 

[edmeister]

As a Repair laision engineer for the last 20 years .. I would like to bring attention how difficult it would be for the line mechaninc to obtain this specialized fastener in the course of normal maintenance. Just because there is an available spec sheet - does not infer that this is a readily avail item. Most fastener mfrs produce these exotic fasteners by the 1000-lot & then retool for other applications. They do not maintain inventory nor sell lessor quantities. Should a requirement for a couple of replacement-items be required - most operators will have to re-engineer for a more common fastener. This will cause undue Expense & Time loss to any operator. Note that a Unionized shop may loose upwards of 10 MHRS on substituting an alternate fastener. Multiply this figure by $100/HR & a minimum of 10 Operators. I strongly suggest redesiging the application for a common nut-plate! - The best design is one that is simple to maintain & understand!

 

[thruthefence]

edmeister, I love your way of thinking.

the following cut'n'paste was from another thread on this board awhile back.

The Successful Designer

The designer bent across his board
With wonderful plans in his noggin stored,
And said as he rubbed his throbbing bean:
"How can I make this tough to machine?
If this part here were only straight
I'm sure the thing would work first rate,
But 'twould be so easy to turn and bore...
It never would make the machinists sore

"I'd better put in a right angle there
(Then watch those babies tear their hair!)
And I'll put the holes that hold the cap
Way down in here where they're hard to tap.

"Now this piece won't work, I'll bet a buck,
For it can't be held in a shoe or chuck;
It can't be drilled and it can't be ground-
In fact, the design is exceedingly sound."

He looked again and cried, "At last!
Success is mine! It can't even be cast!"

A. L. Johnson Co.

 

[WKTaylor]

Edmeister...

As repair liaison and military field service engineer since early '79 I totally agree with You. Worse yet, the increased complexity of aircraft and parts procurment due to extensive use of proprietary materials and hardware specs[BAC, BMS, etc for Airbus] makes materials/parts substitution much harder than ever before. When compares side-by-side, one-to-one, the only true differences between "standard" and "company" parts/materials are the specs they are made/tested to, maybe oversizes and where published "allowables" data is located (and even then, there is usually is NO significant performance differences).

I have acquaintances in my big company working military projects for other companies. They allow designers about 3-months to realize that the "other company" uses “standard materials and parts” [AMS, NAS, MS, etc] that are fully current... even though all of our company design literature says they are “obsolete for future procurement”. They eventually “get it” and stay with the program; or are forced to move-out of the program because they can’t believe and work with the concept of “industry standards”. GAAAAAA I see it a lot in my organization, too, driving-up costs for mod-kits, etc. The Military has a "subtle way to get around some of these issues" where-ever possible: DLA stocklists equivalent standard parts with the company specific parts... under the same NSN [national stock number]... and inetivably buys the "standard part for mil use".

Polysim: almost forgot a few other options for You to consider.

A. Crude but possibly workable: Mounting an NAS1474 [reduced rivet spacing sealed NP] to a sheet metal “tab”… which is then fastened [wet-with sealants rivets, HLs, etc] and away from the area of concern. Holes in base metal can be cold-worked and close-reamed if needed.

B. Click-Bond adhesive bonded nutplates. Installation/removal/replacement simple… but relies on the adhesive for retention. Holes in base metal can be cold-worked and close-reamed if needed. Go to

http://www.enfasco.com/Frame2.html

.

C. NAS1735 “Nut, Self-Locking, Blind Rivet, Elliptical Head, Closed End, 450 Degrees F”. Requires special hole preparation and can be “difficult” to maintain… but are used extensively in wet areas of F-16 wings. See NAS1736 for installation info. I think oversizes are available. I’m am NOT sure if holes can be CX’ed or not.

D. FTI ForceTec rivetless nutplates. They come is unsealed and sealed versions. The base is cold-expanded in a hole using typical split-sleeve methods. The hole in the base can be precision reamed to a tight ID. A nut element is then “snap-locked” into-position. Requires a larger “single hole”, cold working tooling and the base/nut-element but the (2) rivets are eliminated and the installation has benefit of cold working [plastic expansion] for the base material. Problems arise if the installation already has the (2) rivets and fastener hole… then this usually is impractical for many reasons. Go to

http://www.fatiguetech.com/fasteners_forcetec.html

for details.


Regards, Wil Taylor

 

[KENAT]

thread769-210372 was the source.

I swear some designers here live by that poem, I may have been guilty occasionally too;-).

KENAT,

Have you reminded yourself of faq731-376 recently, or taken a look at

http://eng-tips.com/market.cfm?

 

[WKTaylor]

Kenat...

Years ago, Machine Design published the "The wrath of Abbibarshim". Absolutely describes "excesses of engineering".

Other important things I try to remember...

A. Nothing is impossible for the one who does NOT have to do the job.

B. Russian Proverb: better than is the enemy of good-enough.

Regards, Wil Taylor

 

[WKTaylor]

Opps..

"The Wrath of Abbibarshim" was actually published in Production magazine.

Regards, Wil Taylor

 

[Lcubed]

Wil,

I think it was Production Engineering magazine. Thanks for bringing back some old memories and some excellent advice.

Regards,
Lcubed