One size fits all Automatic Transmission fluid 1

[dicer]

Just wondering why a reputable transmission shop would use non manufacture approved fluid, just because the container says
it meets the spec? And we all know that the Fluid manufacture will not cover any damage to the transmission, nor will the shop after a month or so.

 

[gruntguru]

tbuelna.

I don't know about "the land of the free" but here in Australia, consumers have a range of statutory rights that cannot be "signed away" in a warranty document. For example, I am sure the makers would like to void the warranty if you have the car serviced at a non-dealer workshop but the reality is they can't do that.

je suis charlie

 

[tbuelna]

In your example case MOPAR ATF+4 Automatic Transmission Fluid or equivalent licensed ATF+4 product is the specification.

That's not quite right. MOPAR ATF+4 Automatic Transmission Fluid is likely a proprietary product. And in order to manufacture and sell this proprietary product in certain markets you would need a license or permission from MOPAR. In this example the owners manual states you must use the specific trans fluid noted to comply with the factory warranty terms. There is no mention of any specification.

On the other hand, here's what the owners manual states regarding engine oil: "Use API Certified SAE 5W-20 Engine Oil, meeting the requirements of Chrysler Material Standard MS-6395. Refer to your engine oil filler cap for correct SAE grade." As you can see, it allows use of any commercial engine oil product as long as it meets the API certification and Chrysler material standard requirements.

 

[LionelHutz]

ATF+4 IS the specification. ANYONE can make oil that meets the ATF+4 specification. The name ATF+4 has to be licensed from Chrysler.

 

[tbuelna]

"ATF+4" is trademarked by Chrysler and cannot be used without permission. Here's a good description of the situation: "Manufacturers can make ATF+4 fluids, but to use the trademarked ATF+4 name in their compatibility list, they must have their fluids tested and licensed by Chrysler engineers, and must use Lubrizol in their formulations. Licensed fluids are periodically sampled from stores to assure quality."

Here's what Chevron states about their ATF+4 product:

"Chevron ATF+4 Automatic Transmission Fluid has been registered with the Chrysler Corporation, license number 40630035."
"CUSTOMER BENEFITS - Chevron ATF+4® Automatic Transmission Fluid delivers value through: Warranty coverage as an officially approved Chrysler Group fluid"

 

[gruntguru]

Those that have paid for the exclusivity of a trademarked name, naturally want to create the illusion that anything else will void warranty.

je suis charlie

 

[tbuelna]

I would agree Chrysler's approach in this case is partly motivated by revenues from trans fluid sales. But the company does put a significant effort into optimizing the fluid formulation and their transmissions designs to work together, as well as maintaining quality control over licensed production of the fluid. What LionelHutz notes above, about anyone being able to produce a trans fluid that is capable of meeting ATF+4 performance requirements, is basically correct. But they cannot publicly state that the fluid meets ATF+4 specifications/requirements without permission from Chrysler. This is a shrewd US marketing ploy by Chrysler, and regardless of what you or I may feel about the tactic, use of licensed ATF+4 fluid in certain Chrysler vehicles is definitely a warranty requirement.

Besides, it's not like legitimate ATF+4 trans fluid is hard to find. Here is a fairly current list of licensed ATF+4 trans fluid brands:
Advance Auto Parts ATF+4®
Amalie ATF+4®
Auto Extra ATF+4®
AutoZone ATF+4®
Carquest ATF+4®
Castrol ATF+4®
Castrol Transmax ATF+4®
Chevron ATF+4®
Citgo Transgard ATF+4®
Coastal ATF+4®
Craft+4 ATF+4®
Federated Auto Parts ATF+4®
Great Wall ATF+4®
Havoline ATF+4®
MAG 1 ATF+4®
Mobil ATF+4®
Mobil Super ATF+4®
Mopar ATF+4®
NAPA ATF+4®
Northland ATF+4®
O’Reilly ATF+4®
Parts Master ATF+4®
Parts Plus ATF+4®
Pennzoil ATF+4®
Petro-Canada ATF+4®
Proline ATF+4®
Pronto ATF+4®
Pure Guard ATF+4®
Quaker State ATF+4®
Rallye ATF+4®
Ravenol ATF+4®
Sinopec ATF+4®
Super Tech ATF+4®
Tutela Transmission Force4 ATF+4®
Valvoline ATF+4®
Value Tech ATF+4®
Wolf's Head ATF+4®
Xcel ATF+4®

 

[JayMaechtlen]

Interesting, and rather incredible, this:
""Manufacturers can make ATF+4 fluids, but to use the trademarked ATF+4 name in their compatibility list, they must have their fluids tested and licensed by Chrysler engineers, and must use Lubrizol in their formulations."

really? they seem to think I can't mention the term?
Amazing.

Jay Maechtlen

http://www.laserpubs.com/techcomm

 

[tbuelna]

You are free to mention the trademarked name "ATF+4" except if it is for a commercial purpose. This is no different than how any other trademark is treated in the US.

One has to admit that this was a clever business tactic on the part of Chrysler. First they trademark "ATF+4". Then they create warranty requirements to use a trans fluid labeled as meeting "ATF+4" standards. Then they establish requirements for use of the trademark in the marketplace. So even if a fluid meets "ATF+4" performance standards, the producer cannot claim it publicly without permission from Chrysler. And any trans fluid that is not labeled as meeting "ATF+4" standards does not fulfill Chrysler's warranty requirements.

 

[LionelHutz]

So, same as the DEXOS oil I mentioned 3 weeks ago then.....

As GruntGuru alluded to, how would Chrysler know it's not a licensed product if the formulation is correct? At most they'll use some simpler test of the fluid to determine if it's correct.

 

[tbuelna]

The ATF+4 formulation includes a proprietary additive package produced by Lubrizol, so it should be fairly easy to determine the pedigree of a trans fluid sample.

Here is the outfit that handles licensing of the ATF+4 product for Chrysler:

http://www.centerforqa.com/chrysler-licensing/

Going back to the OP, check out what the CFQA has to say in their Q&A section regarding a service shop using a fluid that is not ATF+4 licensed:

"My mechanic didn’t use ATF+4® when changing my transmission fluid. What should I do? - To ensure you have removed most or all of the existing ATF, it is recommended that you perform a total of three (3) changes using ATF+4®. It is further recommended that you do not mix ATF+4® with another automatic transmission fluid (ATF)."

Seriously? They recommend purging the transmission three times using fairly expensive ATF+4 fluid?

 

[gruntguru]

Purging transmissions is difficult. The torque converter cannot be completely emptied without removing it from the car.

je suis charlie

 

[tbuelna]

That brings up an interesting question. Would a trans service shop that did not use an approved fluid be liable for performing the type of corrective action described above? Simply adding a small amount of a non-approved fluid would violate the warranty terms according to Chrysler.

 

[IceStationZebra]

I read an article in a transmission repair magazine recently that said you need six different fluids to cover some 90% of cars on the road right now and they expected that to increase in the future. ISZ