Ordered pipes not in compliance with technical specification 6

[nikolastrojman]

Hi!

We have a situation of a dispute with a delivery company about pipes we ordered from them.

In the project technical specification, it was clearly specified and underlined that only longitudinally welded pipes are acceptable for use in this project.
After we received their offer, we checked it for mistakes/issues but not thoroughly enough only to find out later that spirally welded pipes were delivered to the construction site.
Of course, at this point they are blaming us as the ones who are responsible for this situation!!?

Any advice for this situation, any experience with this kind of issues.

 

[dik]

There was an incident of piping supplied for an airport in Winnipeg a few years ago was substandard. It was failing at 1/10 of the design pressure. It was supplied from China and the test data was exact for all piping, only the test report number varied...

-----*****-----
So strange to see the singularity approaching while the entire planet is rapidly turning into a hellscape. -John Coates

-Dik

 

[LittleInch]

So nikolass, you've had 20 replies and 4 LPS and no response?

Remember - More details = better answers
Also: If you get a response it's polite to respond to it.

 

[weldstan]

Did Purchasing request pipe quotes from a mill that only produces spiral welded pipe and accept the lower cost product. If so, the pipe is yours.

 

[DekDee]

Been on this forum for well over 10 years and still do not know how to "Quote" someone.

Dik,
"There was an incident of piping supplied for an airport in Winnipeg a few years ago was substandard. It was failing at 1/10 of the design pressure. It was supplied from China and the test data was exact for all piping, only the test report number varied..."

Received 2 x plates from a mill in China - totally different heat numbers, totally different Lot numbers, totally different thicknesses.
MTC's reviewed on their own showed compliance with the required standard (that is what the contractor did).
Me, being an old fart who has been around the block a few times reviewed them side by side.
Every single mechanical result exactly the same, every single element of chemical composition exactly the same down to 0.001,
I hate to "tar all Chinese mills with the same brush" as there are some very good mills in China - unfortunately my contractors never pick them. $$$

 

[SJones]

@DD

use the indicated icon for quotes

Steve Jones
Corrosion Management Consultant

http://www.linkedin.com/in/drstevejones

All answers are personal opinions only and are in no way connected with any employer.

 

[LittleInch]

Yes the quotes thing is a bit odd. first copy in the bit you want to quote, then hit the quote button, type in the of the person name, click OK and then where the cursor ends up - between the two ][ paste in the quote.



Remember - More details = better answers
Also: If you get a response it's polite to respond to it.

 

[3DDave]

You pay for metal. You pay for reports. If you want reports to have information about the metal you paid for, that is extra.

 

[KevinNZ]

Regarding bad certificates

We received valves with pressure test certs for the seats but the valves did not have the seat rings installed.

For best results we send an inspector from our country to the factory to witness the process and testing

 

[dik]

My only incident with Chinese manufacturing... I don't have a problem with China; generally their stuff is good. It was just funny that the data was all the same. The same material had passed through maybe a dozen other engineers, and not notice.

-----*****-----
So strange to see the singularity approaching while the entire planet is rapidly turning into a hellscape. -John Coates

-Dik

 

[DekDee]

Steve / LI
Thank you for the assistance - will give it a try.
Cheers,
Shane

 

[DekDee]

first copy in the bit you want to quote, then hit the quote button, type in the of the person name, click OK and then where the cursor ends up - between the two ][ paste in the quote.

 

[DekDee]

Ha Ha Ha ! Old fart is firing now !!!!!!!!

 

[LittleInch]

DekDee,

Yes it took me about ten years as well to figure it out....

The OP meanwhile hasn't been seen since Friday... maybe he got fired for buying the wrong pipe?



Remember - More details = better answers
Also: If you get a response it's polite to respond to it.

 

[r6155]

use the indicated icon for quotes

Thank you Steve and Li

Regards

 

[EdStainless]

We had two sources in China that we used a lot. IT took visiting 13 mill to find those two.
We still visited to witness regularly.
But then we had a rule that if we bought from someone twice we had to witness at least once.
It didn't where they were located.

One reason that many of the Chinese mills had/have issues with test reports is that there is no internal communications.
The chem lab and mech test labs had might as well be outside companies, and no one has any stake in the outcome.


= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
P.E. Metallurgy, consulting work welcomed

 

[nikolastrojman]

Hi guys!

Thank you very much for all the replies, it has been a mess for me this last couple of months

Anyhow, we are in court now with this issue so I´ll tell you the outcome when there is one.
Of course, the contractor didn´t want to hear anything about mutually trying to come up with a solution in the interest for both of us, even though the client hires us and them every time they have a project (ha ha).

 

[LittleInch]

Better late than never.... Thanks for the update.

What happened to the pipe? Installed or sitting ruating in a pipe dump somewhere??

Remember - More details = better answers
Also: If you get a response it's polite to respond to it.

 

[GD2]

OP,
It is up to the Owner to whether accept the spiral welded pipes. No doubt the Owner's receiving inspection did a mess up. Usually, these type of piping will have a 12 months after installation or 18 months from shipment warranty.
If the product is from China, you might land up in an endless battle.
Few of my colleagues have highlighted the pitfall working with Chinese material. The perfect documentation may fool you many times unless you buy the product from the TOP TIER companies.
My personal experience with Chinese Supplier was pretty bad. I realized that many Chinese Trading Cos who supplies material have their own MTR templates even if they don't manufacture. They can fit the result as customer wants.

Notwithstanding the above, ASME B31.3 treats Joint Efficiency as same for both longitudinal seam weld and spiral weld pipes.

GDD
Canada

 

[pierreick]

Hi,
My experience with China, 10 years as Op manager and Projects Manager for a French Company, You get what you pay!
Don't complain if the cost is your driver. Easy to hire third party for inspection, same to get mill certificate.
Pierre

 

[DekDee]

Just a quick comment on third party inspectorates (TPIs).
Having worked as an inspector for some of the largest third party agencies and having hired multiple TPIs since moving into quality management I think I can speak with confidence.
Never rely on third party inspection as a guarantee of quality.
Many inspectors (this is especially so in the Asian region) are freelancers and work for the agencies on an as-needed basis.
Many of them have either worked previously for the company they are inspecting or are hoping to obtain future work with the company they are inspecting.
Please do not get me wrong - there are some excellent TPI's out there. It is just doing a bit of due diligence first.
My current project has utilised 3 x TPI agencies in China (probably the 3 most recognised inspection agencies) and 2 have been removed so far for unsatisfactory inspections.