PFC for residential users 6

[Breaker]

I have come across a device which claims to save on your electricity bill. It is a UK device. I believe it is a con and want to take action against them, but before i do this i want to be sure that i haven't got it all wrong.

The device is a small unit which plugs into any socket in the home, and it claims to perform Power Factor Correction (PFC). However UK residents are charged on kWh and not kVA like industrial users, therfore PFC would not save on the electricity bill.

Also the claim that it can be plugged into any socket is strange, as i can't understand how it could monitor the current, such that it could determine the existing power factor angle, and therefore decide on how much capacitance to switch in. Therefore, whether it does perform effectively PFC is suspect.

Please give me you opinion on this, as i am sure they have already made millions on the unknowledgeable consumers.

 

[jraef]

Snake-oil sellers can't thrive without ignorance (of the) populace.

"Venditori de oleum-vipera non vigere excordis populi"

 

[busbar]

Drats! My computer translated it as Fry floor tiles on both sides and serve with dressing.

 

[jraef]

Announcing a NEW PRODUCT!

The amazing "Power Squeezer" (TM) is so effective at reducing energy that it will save 100% of the power consumed by your machinery. Thats right, not 10%...not 25%... not even 75% savings. When activated, it will COMPLETELY ELIMINATE YOUR POWER BILL !!!

Power Squeezer (TM) is sold exclusively by Oleum-Vipera Industries. Click on the link below for descriptive information.

Act Now! Energy is Wasting!

http://www.asi-interconnect.com/pro...buttons/control_stations/control-stations.gif

"Venditori de oleum-vipera non vigere excordis populi"

 

[stevenal]

Thought I'd take a stab before checking the link. I know it's "new" and "exclusively sold," but does it look anything like a switch? Now I'll look.

 

[jbartos]

Suggestion: There is one more thing that has to be noticed. There are salespersons who do not understand much technical aspects of a product; however, they sell it successfully. Perhaps, a little rhetorics in the product commercial can do the trick.

 

[zenos]

Sounds like a Flux capacitor to me!

 

[Skogsgurra]

I think that you guys are unfair!

The main objection to this device seems to be: "How on earth does it measure the current in the whole installation in order to correct the PF?"

The answer is that it is done exactly the same way as PFC circuits in PC power supplies does it. There are similar products from reputable companies like Vicor and they work with an active front end with a switcher that makes the input current follow the input voltage so that the current drawn is a pure sinewave with zero degree phase-shift. This makes the PF (both distortion PF and displacement PF) equal to 1, which we (I hope) all know is a better situation than consuming short chunks of current, which most "normal" PSUs do. I have measured PC and automation PSU that have PF down to 0.55. VFDs are also known to have very low PF - especiely when idling.

I did look at their home-page and the "box" seems to be a "half shoe-box" unit, which implies that there is room for DC link capacitors and some power electronics. So I do not think that this is a scam at all. Most Power Factor Correction units need that kind of space.

It is very well possible that other companies are in snake oil business, but I do not think that these guys are. Their claim about 25 % saving might be on the high side, though.

 

[Breaker]

skogsgurra

I think you have missed the point and similar to many people would be tricked by this. Would you buy this device, now that you think it will save you money?

If you read the previous posts carefully you will realise that the device cannot measure current for the whole house from an empty socket and thus correct PF. Also, even if it could correct PF, UK homes are charged in kWh and not kVAh so correcting PF will not save on your electricity bill. I am not sure how electricity is charged for residential users in other countries, but I assume it is likely to be charged on kWh. Industrial users are charged on kVAh so PFC works for them.

I have given the details of this product and company to the trading standards agency to investigate, but they seem very slow, and have not yet looked at it in detail. I might try BBC watchdog if nothing comes of it, soon.

 

[Skogsgurra]

Answer to Breaker.

No, I do not think that I would buy one of those devices. I am not plagued by bad PF.

Of course it cannot measure the whole house, only the load after the device. Is that the point that you think I missed?

I am not saying that this is a super product, and I agree that the marketing is a bit exaggerated. But - and this is important - I do not think that it is a scam. It is one among other PFCs that probably does a decent job if you have lots of non-linnear loads in your home.

Do you have other informations?

 

[ScottyUK]

Hi skogsgurra,

I know what you are talking about, but from the

http://www.ep-systems.co.uk

website I'm not sure that their product is what you think it is. Have a look at the Power saver -> Installation & Size page on the website.

This is a verbatim quote from the website:
[blue]All the circuits are connected in parallel at the distribution point. Installing the EPS power saver unit at any point (anywhere within the premises) within these loops will reduce the power loss and therefore reduce the electricity bill.[/blue]

In a typical house, connecting capacitors across the supply would probably improve the PF, but since the domestic user isn't billed for reactive load this is probably not relevant. Without some sensor at the service entry I don't see how it could be controlling anything or be acting as an active filter.

The quote also mentions 'loss' although it doesn't specify which losses. The claimed benefits of the unit are seen at the service entry, so the I^2R losses within the building wiring could actually increase if the unit increases the current flow in a previously unladen circuit. The losses could drop if the circuit the unit is connected to also served an inductive load.

I wonder if it is a clever ruse by the distribution network operators to improve power factor on their network at the expense of their customers .











-----------------------------------

Start each new day with a smile.

Get it over with.

 

[busbar]

Breaker, just to do all your homework on this, it may be a good idea to review the applicable residential electric tariff/rate schedule. [On the North American continent, almost every utility has this information posted at their web sites.] Having documentation assuring that residential customers in your area are billed for kWh (only) can only help your case.

 

[ScottyUK]

Hi busbar,

UK domestic users don't give a damn about power factor 'cos we don't get charged for it. As Breaker is considering approaching the BBC, and the manufacturer has a .co.uk website, I think he's very likely UK-based.

Do some US utilities charge domestic users for reactive load? It is a totally alien concept to a Brit.



-----------------------------------

Start each new day with a smile.

Get it over with.

 

[busbar]

Scotty, in the US, I know of no utility [although there are bunches of ‘em] that charges residential customers for any kind of reactive-power use. In some cases North American utilities do install meters that can be programmed to measure reactive {or apparent} energy and power, but are used simply to minimize their meter inventory. Time-of-use watthour [and possibly watt-demand for the odd large home] is the most complex residential tariff I know of.

The point of suggesting digging up tarriffs was to cover all bases {making no assumptions} should it become a legal or widely publicized matter

 

[Breaker]

RESULT!!!
I finally got a reply from the Trading Standard Agency, here it is.

Croydon Trading Standards have held a meeting at their offices with representatives from Efficient Power Systems.
The implications of a wide range of legislation was discussed with them, including descriptions and safety of products; unfair contract terms and distance selling obligations in connection with their products.
At the moment their energy saving device is not being sold and in future the company does not intend to sell directly to individuals. The company was advised to modify their website in this respect.
Test certificates from a Singapore test house for various components were examined, together with other tests made by the Company. The company was advised to have the product independently tested by an accredited test house in the UK. The company have agreed to look into this.
The company was advised that when stating savings, to state a typical saving and to qualify the type of appliances being used. The company will be monitored.

 

[jraef]

Excellent work Breaker. More people should get involved in holding back the flood of misinformation coming through the internet. I voted you another star. Take it to your boss when it is time for review!

"Venditori de oleum-vipera non vigere excordis populi"