Philadelphia Fire Code

[philadelphia]

I have a question about Philadelphia fire code for fire safety systems, I work for a management company and I have tried to get them to certify the fire safety systems and someone came in and failed them because the system did not have sirens in the bedrooms. I looked up the code and there are supposed to be sirens in the bedrooms to wake someone from deep sleep in case of a fire. But the owner of the management company thinks because the systems where installed 25 years ago he is grandfathered in, is this true? Second I have attempted to get him to install monitoring with a central station for each building which he refuses to also! I am trying to be preventative and bring the buildings up to safety standards and he is fighting me. I called fire codes in Philadelphia and they told be to call building and housing because they don't deal with the codes. I am surrounded by stupid. So it seems I cannot find someone competent to guide me in order to convince him that these changes need to be made. Thanks for any help​

 

[cdafd]

Not sure who you talked to, but it looks like FD does some type of inspection::;

http://www.phila.gov/fire/pdfs/bldg_preparation.pdf

http://www.phila.gov/fire/units_and_services/services_education.html

You might call and try and talk directly to the fire marshal.

As far as your questions yes the bedroom sounders are more than likely not have to be installed, unless pa has a retrofit provision or remodel work is done.

As far as monitoring similar answer but seems like that should be in place no matter what year the building was built


How many stories is the building??

 

[philadelphia]

3 + story buildings. I did call multiple times they seem very un-knowledgeable to the code. I understand that there is no way to get the decibel level where it needs to be without installing horns in the bedrooms. So where can I found out about a retrofit provision. I have the 2012 NFPA fire manual and have actually read through it. Not the best read in the world but gives some insight. Is there such as thing as being Grandfathered in for Fire Safety Systems I don't know how that could be.

Thanks

 

[cdafd]

You want to start with the building and fire code that is adopted by the state or city, ples any modifications.

I think PA has a state code. I do not think the cities can modify it.

Normally a fire protection system is installed under a certain standard, which the standard is updated, norrmally every three years.

But, normally a fire protection system is allowed to exist as is long as it met the standard adopted at the time of installation. Sometimes the more current standard can have retro fit provisions, but not normal.
Or a state/city can add retro fit provisions.

Not sure which 2012 NFPA manual you are looking at??


"""The UCC Administration and Enforcement regulation has adopted the following codes for use throughout the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania, effective 12/31/2012. Only the appendices specified after each code name have been adopted (in addition to the code itself)."""

http://www.portal.state.pa.us/porta...form_construction_code/10524/ucc_codes/553803

 

[philadelphia]

What if the system was installed 25 years ago and never updated or certified? And we need to certify it now I would assume it would have to meet current code! My assumption is that if it were certified year after year it would have been slowly updated to meet current code and we would not be running into these issues. Any toughts

 

[cdafd]

The fire protection systems should have at least an annual inspection/ test. If that is what you mean by certify.

An annual test is just that, does the system work and installed equipement in good shape.

The annual test would not require any systems updated normally.

Once again the way fire protection standards are written, is normally " if a system was installed per the standard adopted at time of isntallation" it normally is not required to meet a more current standard.

 

[TravisMack]

Exactly as CDAFD stated. Unless the building has been renovated to an extent that would trigger an upgrade to the current building code, it could be considered acceptable if it meets the standard enforced at the time it was installed.

For example, many old buildings have pipe schedule systems. Those are only permitted in very few circumstances under the current requirements. However, as long as the building has not changed occupancy (or other things that cause an update requirement), the system is typically considered acceptable.

The annual inspections are to make sure things are in working mechanical order. It is not the purpose of the NFPA 25 inspection to do an engineering analysis of the system each year.

Travis Mack
MFP Design, LLC

http://www.mfpdesign.com

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