Pressure vessels manufactured from UNS S41003 (3Cr12) 2

[mancini]

Can somebody help me with the material specification UNS S 41003 (3Cr12) to be used in a pressure vessel design and in accordance with ASME Sec VIII Div 1:

1) Is it possible to use this material in a ASME PV? This question is because I can not find allowable stresses in ASME.
2) Is there any restriction to use it?
3) Anybody have information or experience about this material properties on welding, fabrication and corrosion resistence?

 

[unclesyd]

Unless things have changed the material is used for PV under Section VIII Div-1. One note of caution is it has a P Number of 6 so it requires a different postweld heat treatment. At one time we had a very large amount of 410 SS inservice as part of a ducted heating system, with about half designed under Section VIII. The only problem was that field repairs could be a bear. Part of the system is still in service after 50+ years.

Here is a website that has some good information from the website.

3CR12® conforms to the European grade for the stainless steel type 1.4003, included in specification EN 10088, which covers stainless steel flat and long products. It is also included in the specification per EN 10028-7 for stainless steels suitable for pressure purposes, which includes minimum specified impact values. 3CR12® is also certified to ASTM A240, UNS S41003.

http://www.olysteel.com/3CR12.phtml

 

[mancini]

Thanks unclesyd,

Regarding ASME Table UHA-32, from this material P Number 6, as the plate in our case will exceed 3/8" thickness, my interpretation from note (1) is that: it is not required the postweld heat treatment for material SA 240 with carbon content not to exceed 0.08% and welded with electrodes that produce an austenitic chromium-nickel weld deposit or a ....

Is my interpretation correct? Is it not necessary the postweld heat treatment in the case of thickness more than 3/8 inches, only if provided a preheat of 450F is maintained during welding and that the joints are completely radiographed?

When you mention that " One note of caution is it has a P Number of 6 so it requires a different postweld heat treatment." and "The only problem was that field repairs could be a bear", may you inform some additional details?

Do you have information about the filler material to be used and any "special" recommendations during welding?

Thanks

 

[unclesyd]

Is my interpretation correct? Is it not necessary the postweld heat treatment in the case of thickness more than 3/8 inches, only if provided a preheat of 450F is maintained during welding and that the joints are completely radiographed?

:: That is if there is an austenitic or non hardening Cr-Ni welding filler used. There is also prequalified procedure using 309 SS filler metal. The 0.08% C content also holds.

When you mention that " One note of caution is it has a P Number of 6 so it requires a different postweld heat treatment." and "The only problem was that field repairs could be a bear", may you inform some additional details.

::We found it somewhat harder to field repair and our system required PWHT, though we did forgo this requirement as the equipment aged. We split the system by leaving part as a coded vessel and the other as duct work.

We used mostly GTAW and small dia wire. At times we used different alloys, like 312 SS, Hast C, and Inco 82 to repair the duct work. Always 410 SS low carbon on the coded part. We did qualify a procedure using 316L as filler metal for vessel repairs. Don't weld when its raining or if the material is damp, H2. It seems as though 410 SS likes H2 more so than CrMo.

Personally 410 SS wouldn’t be my first choice for a MOC. We used it for its high temp properties when not much else was available then used a cookie cutter for several expansions

 

[metengr]

The material that you are referring to (S 41003) is not approved for use by Section II code committee of the ASME Boiler and Pressure Vessel Code. Therefore, you cannot use this material to fabricate a pressure vessel in accordance with ASME Section VIII, Div 1.

If you wanted to consider this material you will need to initiate a Code Case. The requirements for Code Case development are in the Introduction of Section II of the ASME Boiler and Pressure Vessel Code.

 

[unclesyd]

metengr,
Would you please enlighten myself and mancini as to which on of the specifications 3CR12 are allowed by ASME. If I understand you the 410L grade isn't allowed while the 410 and 410S grade are allowed.

http://www.askzn.co.za/tech/tech_grade_3cr12.htm

"Originally 3CR12 was not included in any international specifications. However, a 12 per cent chromium steel developed from 3CR12 has been designated DIN type 1,4003 and ASTM/ASME 41003. The former has been incorporated into two Euronorm Standards viz. EN 10088 and EN 10028, 3CR12 conforms to the requirements of the above specifications and is multi certifiable to 3CR12, 1.4003 and 41003, due to its inclusion in the above specifications. 3CR12 vessels and tanks can be designed in accordance to BS5500, ASME, AD Merkblatter codes and the Euronorm design specification currently in preparation."

 

[mancini]

Hi unclesyd,

This is my main point, may I use a material that I can not find specific information about allowable stresses from ASME Sec II ,Table 1A? In other words, to use the material 3CR12 (UNS S41003) at design temperature of 400 F, which is the allowable stress from ASME Sec VIII Div 1?

I Additionally would like to inform that from ASME Sec II D (Table 1A) it is informed the Sa from materials UNS S41000 (410) and UNS S41008 (410S) but no information about UNS S41003.

Thanks.

 

[metengr]

unclesyd and mancini;
Ok. According to ASME Section VIII, Div 1 UHA, Table UHA-23, the following grades of 410 SS are permitted;
UNS 41008 (410 S with 0.08% max C) and UNS 41000 (410 with .15% max carbon). If you read UHA-11, regarding material any material that will be exposed to stress must conform to one of the mateial specificationlisted in Section II.

I checked Section II stress tables for UNS 41003. Grades 41000 and 41008 are listed. UNS 41003 material (0.03% C max) is not listed for Section I, III or VIII applications.

The only reference I could find that mentions UNS 41003 is SA 240. I checked all applicable code cases and could not find any related to allowable stress values for UNS 41003 material in pressure vessels.

 

[metengr]

mancini;
Unless the material is listed in Section II, Part D Table 1A it cannot be used in the pressure vessel if it is subjected to stress under pressure. This is clearly stated in UHA-11. I checked in UG-4 and other applicable sections. If the material will NOT be subjected to stress, you could use the material. If it is welded to the pressure boundary as trim, it could also be used provided it is weldable.

Your only other option is to generate a Code case for your specific application.

 

[codeeng]

I recall this material originating in South Africa about 25 years ago. There was an application to have it certified for pressure vessel use and it was rejected then. Often used as a liner having good wear resistance but lacking ductility. Not sure of its current status.

 

[mancini]

OK, Thanks metengr and unclesyd.

 

[unclesyd]

I found out why the material was rejected as a code material, it was because it was from Colombus Steel in South Africa at the time SA was being boycotted.

mancini I have to defer to metengr.
Sorry I misled you as to the use of this material under Section VIII Div. 1. I'm still a little confused as most of the producers still refer to it under the same specs referenced by Action Steel(above). Apparently 3CR12 SS is 409 SS even though some producers list it as 410L (S41003)

http://www.azom.com/details.asp?ArticleID=968

"This "utility stainless steel" is a proprietary modification of Grade 409 chromium stainless steel. It has been developed as a readily fabricated, low cost grade, exhibiting good resistance to wet abrasion and mildly corrosive environments. National specifications cover this grade by designations 1.4003 and UNS S40977 / S41003.

The designation "3CR12" is a registered trade mark of Columbus Stainless, the original developers of the grade, and who are still active in research into its production, fabrication and application. Proprietary 3CR12 conforms to EN 10088.2 grade 1.4003, ASTM A240/A240M grades UNS S40977 and S41003 and ASME SA240 grades UNS S40977 and S41003. 1.4003 is also included in EN 10028.7 covering stainless steels for pressure purposes."

 

[weld2eng]

The use of UNS S41003 for pressure vessels was addressed in ASME Case Code CC2358.

This refers to another ASTM spec A1010 which also references grade UNS S41003, and the ruling gives scope of application.

Note that 3CR12 was only ever certified to ASTM A240 UNS S41003, and not UNS S40977.

 

[metengr]

Only UNS 410003 supplied under ASTM A 1010-00, which meets the chemical composition and mechanical properties requirements of this specification applies. However, it is important to note that some Jurisdictions in the US do not accept code case material for new construction.

Some limitations per the Code Case are;
600 deg F max temp
thickness less than 3/4"
material cannot be used for external pressure applications

Prior to the 2004 Edition of the ASME Code, code case 2358 was set to expire on 5/31/04. I reviewed the 2004 Edition of the Code, and it appears that this code case was re-affirmed on 2/20/04.

 

[sonargodz]

Sirs,

I am wondering if anyone knows of a source for seamless (not dom welded) tubing similar to Timken T90 or T95. I am designing a pressure vessel for pnuematic application that needs to be 1.5 inches OD with a .12 wall thickness.

I would like the yield strength of the alloy to be at least 60kpsi so that my pressure vessel can operate at 3000 psi with Nitrogen or dry air.

I am a novice mechanical engineer, and any words of advice or suggestions are appreciated in advance.

 

[weld2eng]

I understand that UNS S41003 is now included in ASME IIa SA240.

 

[metengr]

weld2eng;
I just checked Section II, Part D, Table 1A of the 2004 Edition, UNS 41003 is not listed in Table 1A. Where did you obtain this information?

 

[weld2eng]

It is listed in ASME SA240 which it quotes as being identical to ASTM A240-97.