Questions for Mechanical engineer technologist 4

[RBX]

Any of you guys ME technologists?

Ive been an ME tech for about 6 years designing machines and i love it..but i would like to perfect myself and thinking of taking some extra course at Uni.(maybe some kinematics and some structural courses)

Just wondering if you guys ever felt the need to get a few extra engineering courses at Uni wich and which ones?

 

[indme]

I graduated BSMET from an ABET accredited school in the USA. Here is my experience after about 8 years in Industry. I don't think my case is exceptional for MET grads.

- I've always been titled 'engineer' and worked alongside BSME's and MSME's doing the same work that they do. I'm often checking their work or mentoring them.

- I applied for an MSME program at a 'good' program in a major school and was provisionally accepted, 6 years after BSMET. I was told to take 3 additional math classes that represent the difference between my ABET MET program and the ABET ME program. At 8 years out of school, I decided that the benefit/cost was not high and that the MSME program time commitment was more likely to end with me in divorce court rather than the Chief Engineer position, so I decided to forget it.

- I took the FE Exam and passed it, several years out of school, without taking a study course. Just studying at home for a few months in between the screams of a crying baby. I could take the PE, but at this point I'm trying to see what benefit it has.

- Customers have paid to have me come all over the world to advise them on engineering problems, traveling first class, staying in nice hotels on their expense and they were happy to have me. I've been greeted by the upper management up to VP level at several large multinational engineering companies, taken out to dinners, and spent time with them over weekends when they could have been doing something else. People like you if you bring results, regardless of what academic background you came from. Similarly, if you are Doctor of ME andf tenured professor and can't bring results for whatever reason, they'll hate you and think you don't know anything.

- My salary is above average for my level.

- I do Code work often for things related to public safety on a large scale. Since I am not a PE yet, I don't take legal responsibility but I am the one doing the physics.

- I feel like I am seeing more jobs posting that call for technical degrees, or specifically say science or engineering technology as an option, versus 5 or 10 years ago. It seems a lot of good people that would have previously signed up for BSME or similar are going into other fields with better long term options in the USA, like biotech. My employer gets a lot of resumes from BS/MSME's who have been dumping engineering off on vendors for so long that they forget how to calculate anything themselves, so they also look at Physics, Math, and Technology majors who have a demonstrated recent ability to design and calculate things.

- Once in industry, you learn a lot on the job that isn't taught in any program. Sometimes you need to do DiffEQ's and things like that, but what really sets you apart as an engineer is your ability to tell facts from assumptions, synthesize info, develop a course of action, and communicate your desires in a way that makes things happen. Anyone can look into a book after graduation and figure out how to do Eigenvalues, for example. In my experience with large companies, it's recognized that if you need additional technical knowledge you'll either find it alone or ask for training. The important thing is understanding technical needs, how to get to results, where to find info, and how to navigate all the internal and external customer and vendor processes to get results. In my last 2 job interviews, I got offers both times and my type of degree was never a topic of discussion.

In summary, the best way to improve yourself is not more class work. Take jobs in various industries, do overseas jobs and learn how to work with different cultures and design philosophies, and never pass up an opportunity to learn some new engineering methods or skills.

I wish I had known all this when I was earning my BSMET. Coming out of HS, I did not have the money for tuition and room and board to attend a far away school with an ME program. I started part time in an extension of a large school that had an AS MET and worked until I had money to move, attend full-time and get a BSMET at the main campus. During this time, the economy was in the dumps post-IT bubble burst and 9/11. I listened to the talk of academics at the school about 'Technologists' and wondered if I'd ever be recognized for my ability to be an engineer. Once out of academia, I realized that this is basically politics and that in practice it does not matter which degree you have. If I could go back, and I had the money to start in the traditional engineering program I might still choose MET because it leaves out coursework that is rarely practiced and adds more of the practical things that differentiates engineers from scientists such as manufacturing processes, statistics, etc.

 

[TheTick]

"engineering technologist" = "engineering without math" = "not engineering, but you get to work around engineers"

Honesty may be the best policy, but insanity is a better defense.

http://www.EsoxRepublic.com

-SolidWorks API VB programming help

 

[SNORGY]

My personal experience in Alberta has been that most of the "Technologists", in day-to-day work, are better than most of the "Engineers". There is something about how the NAIT's and SAIT's of the world relate the physics and mathematics of things to practicable skills and knowledge that is lacking - or certainly was lacking when I was in university - in a BSc. program in engineering. To be honest, the best mentors I have ever had in my line of work were CET's, not P.Eng.'s.

Once in a while, something comes up where you need a triple integral or complicated differential to solve, or some fracture mechanics or metallurgical gem of insight is possessed by the engineer and not by the technologist. At my age, I'd have to crack a textbook and spend a day or two boning up on the theory before entering into an intelligent attempt at solving such things; meanwhile, the CET who brought the issue to my attention has probably already applied some logic, made some assumptions, and boiled it down to some simple graph or algebraic expression that comes close enough to anything that I end up with. At that point, the engineer has verified what the technologist has done, but the technologist has still done it well enough.

Myself, for example, I'd rather have a CET review a WPS / PQR or look at a butt-weld x-ray before assigning an engineer - like me - who has never picked up a welding rod in his or her life. There are things that technologists learn - and know - that engineers simply don't learn or know. That is why I favour a system in which the governing associations work towards clearer definitions of their respective scopes of practice.

A wise man once put it to me this way:

(1) Engineers develop technology.
(2) Technologists apply the technology developed by engineers.
(3) Technicians implement the technology developed by engineers and applied by technologists.

Why there is such a big controversy over the above is because there isn't a big job market - at least not here - purely in the development of technology, so engineers and technologists compete for the only work that is left over: applying currently existing (but, more commonly, antiquated) technology towards solving problems.

Engineers need to get back to roles in which they are doing what they are supposed to be doing, rather than just reading an ASME Code or a piece of Legislation that states what their Client needs to do. As far as I am concerned, if that is what engineering has deteriorated to - and, sadly, in my mind, it is - then even a high school graduate with some algebra and reading skills can do the job.

Regards,

SNORGY.

 

[Sparweb]

My dad put it even more simply to me before I chose my post-secondary education:

A technician can fix your TV, but he can barely tell you how it works.
An engineer knows exactly how your TV works, but he can't fix one that's broken.
A technologist can do both, though with a bit of fussing around.

I know now that it's not that simple, but in hindsight I'm glad he told me that.

Snorgy: Since you're in Alberta, have you looked at the new ASET classifications yet?


Steven Fahey, CET

 

[SNORGY]

SparWeb:

I haven't really looked into the new ASET classifications or given the relevant issues the attention that they deserve. I have been on a paid LOA for the past 3 months, playing with my dogs (secondary career).

However, I know that my opinions aren't necessarily those of other P.Eng.'s in our Association, but I stand behind them. Engineers typically graduate from university armed with all of the knowledge and theory that they need to contribute towards changing the world and advancing technology, only to find themselves in enormously watered-down digressions from that ideal as a career, and within ten years, their "expertise" is comparable to that achieved by an Honours Grade 12 matriculation student. Further, their mandate is changed by society (specifically by MBA's) from "make things for us" to "make moiney for us".

It's truly a sad state of affairs.

Regards,

SNORGY.

 

[SNORGY]

And then they start misspelling things like "moiney".

The depression reaches a new low...

Regards,

SNORGY.

 

[Sparweb]

It's okay Snorgy, I understud wut you ment.

Just to carry on a bit more about technologist certifications in Alberta - there's been a recent push at the political level to amalgamate the organizations of the professional engineers (APEGGA) with the Techs (ASET). The compromise struck (I think) was that the two bodies would work together to provide "bridges" between the two solitudes. Apart from some foot-dragging on the part of the PE's (who see this as a step down) and giddy enthusiasm on the part of the Techs (seeing it as a step up) the process may actually be under way.



Steven Fahey, CET

 

[SNORGY]

Somewhere in the move, I forgot to forward my change in mailing address to APEGGA, and I have been PEGG-less for the entire summer. Time to get back into the loop.

Regards,

SNORGY.