Returning to a former employer 2

[Gstoner]

I have a situation that I have not encountered before. I received a call last week from a former supervisor (whom I am using as a reference while job hunting) to see if I was interested in returning to work for a former employer. Now, I figure that if the owner (small company, 15-20) asks the supervisor to call me, then the ball may not be in my court, but it sure is headed in my direction at least.

Before I left, I had a loooong exit interview with my supervisor, telling him everything. Some may agree with the exit interview, some not. Regardless, I had 'assumed' that I had burned a bridge (most of reasons for leaving were due to personality conflicts with the owner) and so was quite surprised to get a phone call about returning. I will admit that leaving there in the first place was definitely a "grass is greener..." situation...which I have found to be spray painted concrete. *sigh* I have also thought for quite a while that most of the conflicts could have been worked out, but I have never wanted to jeopardize my position at any job by "barking back", so I would look for a new job...then leave.

So, as a summary, I would LOVE to return, but need to discuss a few items with the owner.

1. conflict resolution (ask him, while he's in a good mood, how I should handle future clashes / differences with him)
2. I really can't take a pay / benefits cut, but I really enjoyed the work I was doing when I was there (and can't stand what I'm doing now)

Questions:
Is money or happiness more important? just opinions, I know every situation is different, just looking for a general consensus.

What other issues have any of you ever had when you have returned to a former employer? I've never returned to a former employer, so this is new ground for me.





"A Designer knows that he has achieved Perfection not when there is nothing left to add, but when there is nothing left to take away" - Antoine de Saint-Exupry

 

[MadMango]

A little more info might help us in general. How long were you there, how long have you been gone? Were these conflicts with the owner ethical in nature, or did you guys just not get along?

I was asked to return to a previous company after being gone for 2yrs. The ball is in your court, and I think since your company is so small maybe more so. Be fair to yourself, stick to your guns, don't play games, and don't try to squeeze water from a stone (ok, I'm out of figures of speech). Have it in your mind of what it will take for you to return and don't deviate.

"Art without engineering is dreaming; Engineering without art is calculating."

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[QAFitz]

Happiness in what you are doing is always better than money. You spend more awake time at work than at home so why not be happy for the better part of your day?
As for the conflict resolution issue, whatever the outcome get it in writing and ask if it outlives the current owners commitment. If the current owner retires/sells etc. whare will you be?
In these economic times the pay / benefits issue must be cleared to your satisfaction and again, in writing.
The "in writing" may seem a bit overboard but if they are seeking you, you may never get this opportunity again. If you are seeking them then ask yourself what may happen if you don't get it in writing.

 

[Gstoner]

I was at the former employer for 2.5 years, and have been gone for 2 years now.

Conflicts (looking back from 2 years perspective) were more along the lines of 2 hard-headed people butting heads. Yes, mountian goats do it all the time, but my wife tells me that I only have 2 feet...and they're not hooves

"A Designer knows that he has achieved Perfection not when there is nothing left to add, but when there is nothing left to take away" - Antoine de Saint-Exupry

 

[rbulsara]

2.5 years and head butting with Owner? The Owner will not change nor is he going to leave the company. Unless YOU change drastically, you will find yourself in the same situation.

So go back there only if you liked there before. Do not expect drastically different environment.

Listen to wife, perhaps the person who knows you best.



Rafiq Bulsara

http://www.srengineersct.com

 

[cksh]

I can't imagine the owner changing his ways. And there will always be that awkwardness, at least there would be for me, of why you quite the first time, hanging over everyone's head.

Would the whole office know why you quit?
Are you sure that your supervisor informed the owner of why you left? He may have chickened out knowing that he would basically have to tell the owner it was because of his (owner's) personality. Most of my supervisors would have played it down or made something up. I have quite because of owners/supervisors, but would have never given that as a reason.

Loving what you do is important, but just make sure that that is worth enough to overshadow the issues you may have to face again.

To me, dealing with coworkers, especially the owner, is part of the job. Regardless of what my actual job function is, if my coworkers are hard to get along with, then my job as a whole sucks. Obviously, the owner was hard enough to deal with that you quite.

That would have to be one heck of a job. Returning to an old job is very simlar to taking a counteroffer from a current employer after you give your notice.

 

[photoengineer]

In a nutshell, I wouldn't do it.

There are a lot of engineering jobs out there. You can find something new.

Cedar Bluff Engineering

http://cedarbluffengineering.webs.com

 

[SNORGY]

I have quit and returned before, as is the situation where I currently work.

When I left a few years ago, I told them what it was that caused me to want to leave. When I interviewed with them and was re-hired some time later, I told them exactly what things would prompt me to want to leave again if they were to be repeated.

Both sides have done their very best to avoid a repeat of things past, now that those things are clearly identified. It's workable...maybe I am just lucky enough to work with some very professional, fair and compassionate people here.

In my mind, happiness should always be chosen before money.

My sad experience is that the grass is never "greener" anywhere else. It's just that there are countless shades of green, but they're all green, even the ones that are stained towards the "yellow" side of green.

(Let that analogy sink in a bit...)

Regards,

SNORGY.

 

[oldfieldguy]

"My sad experience is that the grass is never "greener" anywhere else. It's just that there are countless shades of green, but they're all green, even the ones that are stained towards the "yellow" side of green."

Being raised in the country, I know that the reason for much green grass is the amount of sh*t used to fertilize it.

I left an employer for a job with better technical challenges but relatively worse pay. Three years later one of those "restructurings" brought about by change in government regulation pretty much killed my happy little job and I eyeballed my former employer, catching him at a time when he was "over a barrel", so to speak, in one of his field offices. I basically wrote myself an offer and he had to take it.

He was not resentful up front, but in a couple of years he got the idea that he could demolish me by going after some of my staff, and I had to quit. In talks with my (former) co-workers later I found that he'd been plotting his move for months.

old field guy

 

[KENAT]

I used to work at a boomerang company - a lot of people had at some point left, then come back. In many cases I suspect it was because as you say the grass looked greener untill you realize it's astroturf or paint etc. Heck, if I could, I'd go back.

Certainly I'd think you need to address the reasons why you left to have some hope of not regretting it within weeks. Sounds like Snorgy's advice is good on that front.

On the money V happiness thing, think about it practially. There's no point killing yourself in a miserable job for more money than you need. However, is it fair to take a job you love if it pays so little that your dependants (assuming you have some) suffer? If it's just you then obviously do what makes you happiest overal between the work/life balance.

For my part, I think the happiness at work thing is over rated these days. I'd have thought if nothing else the current economy would have made people more realistic on this front at last. Throughout history, I doubt most people have done the work they did because they 'enjoyed it', my guess is for the most part they did it to survive, and at most chose the least bad option. What makes us today think we're so special that we only need to do things we like? I spend a lot of time and effort trying to make sure my kid doesn't take this kind of attitude (yest you have to clean your roome etc. even if you don't like it) and the come on here and see it being espoused all the time.

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[Maui]

If the reasons that caused you to leave your prior job have not been corrected, then you will still have to deal with them if you return. And this may prove more difficult now having voiced your reasons for leaving in detail during your exit interview. The owner is unlikely to change, so it sounds as though you will be the one who will have to change in order to adapt to this environment. If you feel that this is not practical or likely (I suspect it isn't), then you will find yourself in an unhappy circumstance again. If it is still more attractive than where you are now, you can consider making the move back to your former employer. But I would not recommend it for the reasons stated. I suggest that you look elsewhere. Why live an unhappy past experience over again? Learn from it and move on to something that suits you better.

Maui

 

[shamsdebout]

I would only go back if I was looking for more, you sound like you are working now. It would be too uncomfortable for me, its one of those situation that I wouldn't want to return to. I would just look for another job while I work at my current job.

 

[ajack1]

With the benefit of hindsight how many of the arguments you had were down to you?

Most people I know at some point have fallen out with their parents, because they were always telling them what to do and knew nothing. Looking back nearly all those people now think their parents were looking out for them and actually offered very sound advice. The I always know best is very much like the grass is always greener.

So if you think most of the previous problems were down to you, go back. If you still think most of the problems were down to your old boss, don’t go back.

 

[ctopher]

Ask if layoff's are coming. Ask how the company is doing financially. Do a little research on the company.
They could bring you in only to lay you off instead of someone else.
Been there...

Chris
SolidWorks 09 SP4.1
ctopher's home
SolidWorks Legion

 

[KENAT]

"Ask if layoff's are coming" I find it hard to believe you'd get a truthfull answer to this question, at least from any management. However, the idea of doing a bit of digging aint a bad one.

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[ctopher]

True, probably will not get an honest answer, but does not hurt to ask.

Chris
SolidWorks 09 SP4.1
ctopher's home
SolidWorks Legion

 

[ajack1]

I would think it is highly unlikely that a small company of that size would be hiring one day and firing the next.

 

[ctopher]

ajack1,
I agree. It would be weeks or months.

Chris
SolidWorks 09 SP4.1
ctopher's home
SolidWorks Legion

 

[diarmud]

SKIP the conflict/resolution interview when (if) you go back.

How many issues you butted heads on were so severe that someone would be hurt, cost would go up/down dramatically, etc. In other words, how important were they really?

If you can't change, don't go back, the owner won't change. But examine why you were in conflict . . . was it personality or was it ego or was it something really important to the ouitcome of the work?

I never appreciated an employee creating a problem because they felt they were right when in fact it really was just different ways of skinning the cat.

Conflict can be good if handled correctly (make every attempt to allow everyone to save face) but if it is all the time, then you are just a pain in the ...

Good luck.

 

[mechmama]

I haven't seen anyone ask if you will be doing something different from what you did before. If you will be doing the same thing you did the first time and not gaining any new technical skills, don't waste your time. (It's the old 20 years of experience or one year of experience 20 times question.)