We are currently setting up schedules within Revit Structure 2010 that will do take offs for us giving us each wall what rebar they will need with lengths, bends etc. We also have the rebar tonnage take off and yardage of concrete. Have other firms done this? If so, do you charge extra for this scheduling for ease of bidding? And how do you go about charging for this? Thanks
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Revit Scheduling, do you charge
- Thread starter buzter
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structuresguy
Structural
No, we don't do this. I can't see how you could get reasonably accurate tonnages as there are so many things that Revit does not consider.
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oneintheeye
Structural
it can been done fairly accuratly I understand (from our companies experience). Surely you just charge it as a service. x hours = y cost?
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- #5
The thing is, the schedule (hours to set up) is done already. When we do projects from now on, the schedule will populate it self when we put the rebar in the model, so really there is not much extra time other than putting the schedule on the sheets. That is why we are having a hard time of how to really charge for this, but it would be something that would help them out alot.
My experience is like buzters. This is very time consuming and you'll be doing some Revit "programming". Revit does some of it "out of the box", but you'll have some trouble getting the output you want. You'll spend a lot of time formatting the schedules themselves and you'll spend a lot more time modeling everything perfectly. You will have to model every tie, stirrup, and piece of footing rebar. The guys bidding projects have estimators. You don't have to do the work for them, unless you are getting paid to.
rowingengineer
Structural
Don't forget time for checking, While your program may be a "wiz bang" here is your awnser, The checking should still be by the old pen and paper Method (and should take longer).
Arguing with an engineer is like wrestling with a pig in mud. After a while you realize that they like it
Arguing with an engineer is like wrestling with a pig in mud. After a while you realize that they like it
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- #8
larsacious
Structural
This sounds like a time consuming and dangerous direction to take your CD's in. First of all, this is a lot of extra work that you shouldn't do unless you are being compensated for. Second, what happens when you miss a wall somewhere and your rebar quantity is off? The contractor is going to love it because of the change order associated with it and the owner is just going to point the finger at you. Also, you are not going to get recognition for the extra work and it will be expected from you in the future with this client. Third, Revit isn't perfect. Footing steps are difficult, walls sometimes don't merge correctly, etc.
There is a myriad of potential problems associated with this...
There is a myriad of potential problems associated with this...
We have schedules that are shown on tender issues. I don't think you should be charging extra for it unless you are taking responsibility for the quantities. If you can produce accurate estimates along with all the other BIM capabilities that revit has to offer, then other companies will be aware of this prior to employing you.
The schedules need to be checked if you are going to put them on the drawings.
The schedules need to be checked if you are going to put them on the drawings.
My advice to anyone interested in doing this would be to buy Tekla Structures instead of Revit. You will save all that time doing Autodesk's job for them, not to mention the info you obtain will be extremely accurate.
Revit = DumbBIM
Tekla = SmartBIM
Just my opinion though.
Actually, wait........you guys are my competition....doh.
Use Revit, it is the greatest program ever developed! That many architects could not possibly be wrong.
Revit = DumbBIM
Tekla = SmartBIM
Just my opinion though.
Actually, wait........you guys are my competition....doh.
Use Revit, it is the greatest program ever developed! That many architects could not possibly be wrong.
I am starting to discover the downfalls of BIM prior to BIM being established fully.
1. Working in 3D modelling space where all consultants work on one central file is great. Except the fact that consultants are not working on a central file but separate individual files, create 2D plans, convert back to AutoCad files, send to other consultants who import into their files and find that nothing co-ordinates and everything is clashing.
1. Working in 3D modelling space where all consultants work on one central file is great. Except the fact that consultants are not working on a central file but separate individual files, create 2D plans, convert back to AutoCad files, send to other consultants who import into their files and find that nothing co-ordinates and everything is clashing.
oneintheeye
Structural
Interested in this thread our company is heading very seriously into the BIM world. Using Revit. A trial has the quantities fairly accurate on one building. In theory we are going into it as cutting down on estimating time and costs as well as other benefits. Any comments?
rowingengineer
Structural
Herewegothen,
First thing is to make sure you have revit structural not arch, or when you get onto steel detailing your head will exploded. Using revit to do estimating didn't cut down on the overall process time, because we found checking time increased, double if you have a drafty who is fresh. The other problem with revit was the time taken to do detailing of non-standard connections was onerous, unitl we decided it was best to draw these in autocad and import into revit.
Arguing with an engineer is like wrestling with a pig in mud. After a while you realize that they like it
First thing is to make sure you have revit structural not arch, or when you get onto steel detailing your head will exploded. Using revit to do estimating didn't cut down on the overall process time, because we found checking time increased, double if you have a drafty who is fresh. The other problem with revit was the time taken to do detailing of non-standard connections was onerous, unitl we decided it was best to draw these in autocad and import into revit.
Arguing with an engineer is like wrestling with a pig in mud. After a while you realize that they like it
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- #15
Herewegothen...
That is how we are trying to approach Revit, give our contractors some close numbers to do their numbers with. I believe with Reviit you could be just as close as their estimators. But would you be able to charge for this...or probably just include it in your fees at the start. Then if you do it in your bid, you get outbid by the other guys, but you are providing them so much more.
That is how we are trying to approach Revit, give our contractors some close numbers to do their numbers with. I believe with Reviit you could be just as close as their estimators. But would you be able to charge for this...or probably just include it in your fees at the start. Then if you do it in your bid, you get outbid by the other guys, but you are providing them so much more.
paddingtongreen
Structural
It's difficult responding to questions like this one without knowing the contract with the owner, and the terms of the bid documents. If we are speaking of a set of finished drawings and specs, and if the bidders are to detail the rebar, the bidders should do their own estimates. Most of the estimating managers can quickly calculate volume and the number of lbs/CuYd for the reinforcing very accurately as a check. I wouldn't give them anything they can blame for a mistake.
On the other hand, if it is a fast track job where you ask for bids on incomplete drawings, based on your quantity and degree of difficulty estimates, you must provide the numbers. But then, when the real numbers are known they are change ordered into the contract and the contract cost updated .
Michael.
Timing has a lot to do with the outcome of a rain dance.
On the other hand, if it is a fast track job where you ask for bids on incomplete drawings, based on your quantity and degree of difficulty estimates, you must provide the numbers. But then, when the real numbers are known they are change ordered into the contract and the contract cost updated .
Michael.
Timing has a lot to do with the outcome of a rain dance.
Just curious.
Did any of you evaluate more than one BIM program before choosing.
It seems that most of you use Revit, but I do not understand why you would choose Revit over Tekla.
My only guess is that you have not seen very much of Tekla, or that your Architect uses Revit, so you do too.
Did any of you evaluate more than one BIM program before choosing.
It seems that most of you use Revit, but I do not understand why you would choose Revit over Tekla.
My only guess is that you have not seen very much of Tekla, or that your Architect uses Revit, so you do too.
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