I work (I have been there for about 1.5 years)for a small company and last year I got a really good evaluation but only a 1.8% raise. He said he had a bad year so I didn't think much of it. But since then me and another engineer have started quizzing him about the future. He made the comment that if he gave us 3 to 4% raises every year then in 10 years we would be making $100,000 and he also claimed the inflation rate last year was negitive 1.5% (deflation) which I know isn't true. What type of raises do you typically get? Would you consider a raise less than the cost of living a deduction in salary? I am currently looking for another job. I am expecting that advice from some of you. Thanks for any input.
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Should I expect at least a cost of living raise 8
- Thread starter redbridge
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- #2
Engineering is a career profession, which means that as well as developing your skills with experience you should also be earning more money in real terms as time goes on.
Labourers should be getting cost of living raises, not professional engineers. I would consider 4% as a reasonable minimum raise for an engineer regardles of inflation.
The increased earning with professions is such an intrinsic part that, in the UK at least, the banks will actually lend a young professional more money compared to their salary than a non-professional. Beacause they assume that your income will go up.
If you are not getting a raise in real terms then look for somewhere that will. But stay put until you can get at least a 10% higher salary.
csd
Labourers should be getting cost of living raises, not professional engineers. I would consider 4% as a reasonable minimum raise for an engineer regardles of inflation.
The increased earning with professions is such an intrinsic part that, in the UK at least, the banks will actually lend a young professional more money compared to their salary than a non-professional. Beacause they assume that your income will go up.
If you are not getting a raise in real terms then look for somewhere that will. But stay put until you can get at least a 10% higher salary.
csd
GregLocock
Automotive
1.5% deflation is not a recognised figure.
I bitch and moan if I get less than 4%.
Cheers
Greg Locock
Please see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips.
I bitch and moan if I get less than 4%.
Cheers
Greg Locock
Please see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips.
Where are you? How is the engineering market there? Often the best way to get a great raise is to get a new job...and if you hang around too long with no raises, other employers are going to think something is wrong with you since you don't make enough money...
-The future's so bright I gotta wear shades! B-)
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-The future's so bright I gotta wear shades! B-)
Please see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of the Eng-Tips Forums.
There is a thread in here about average raises with a large sample of numbers. I got an 8.33% raise this year (my 1st year out of school). If I got a 1.8% raise I would outta there yesterday. Also, at 4% it would take 18 years to double your salary. So even if you started at 50k, it would take 18 years to get to 100k, not 10. I would look for another job asap!!
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Try looking at it from a different perspective and you will go further in your career.....how much do you bring in and / or contribute to the bottom line in comparison to what you are paid plus the overhead expenses to keep you around?
If you are not profitable for the company, it would be difficult to justify paying you more. A raise is not a right. If you want to make more, help the company make more.
ZCP
If you are not profitable for the company, it would be difficult to justify paying you more. A raise is not a right. If you want to make more, help the company make more.
ZCP
Inflation is generically considered to be 3% a year, but usually hovers right about 2.3-2.9. The U.S. economy cannot have had deflation as it is currently set up. I would expect 3% as a minimum (no reward, moderate to serious negative feedback). 1.8% is technically a wage decrease when factoring in inflation.
BTW, sms had good advice.
Matt
CAD Engineer/ECN Analyst
Silicon Valley, CA
sw.fcsuper.com
Co-moderator of Solidworks Yahoo! Group
BTW, sms had good advice.
Matt
CAD Engineer/ECN Analyst
Silicon Valley, CA
sw.fcsuper.com
Co-moderator of Solidworks Yahoo! Group
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My evaluation based raises have ranged from 1.5% to 10%, with an average of 5%. My job change based raises have been 20% and 35%.
If he insists that inflation was -1.5% last year he is lying, ignorant, or misinformed, none of which are traits I look for in someone upon whom my income is dependent. To get to 100K in 10 years, assuming 3.5% raises per year, you are now making 70K. If you are 1.5 years out of school (which I may have incorrectly inferred), I think you are doing pretty well at 70K. If you don't make 70K now, this guy is mathematically challenged, another unattractive trait (I hope my calculation is correct since I'm so quick to judge).
If you choose to stay, perhaps you can request more responsibility and a greater raise. I assume your responsibilities do not include bringing in new work and you have no equity. If not, he had the bad year, not you. If you got a good evaluation and you are deserving and capable of more responsibility but he can't provide it for you, perhaps you can find it elsewhere.
Based on my perception of your situation, if it were me, I'd be hunting for another job like you are.
If he insists that inflation was -1.5% last year he is lying, ignorant, or misinformed, none of which are traits I look for in someone upon whom my income is dependent. To get to 100K in 10 years, assuming 3.5% raises per year, you are now making 70K. If you are 1.5 years out of school (which I may have incorrectly inferred), I think you are doing pretty well at 70K. If you don't make 70K now, this guy is mathematically challenged, another unattractive trait (I hope my calculation is correct since I'm so quick to judge).
If you choose to stay, perhaps you can request more responsibility and a greater raise. I assume your responsibilities do not include bringing in new work and you have no equity. If not, he had the bad year, not you. If you got a good evaluation and you are deserving and capable of more responsibility but he can't provide it for you, perhaps you can find it elsewhere.
Based on my perception of your situation, if it were me, I'd be hunting for another job like you are.
I used to work for a boss very similar to your. He kept telling me that with time i could be making upwards to $100K, unfortunely he was paying me peanuts and raises were unreasonable (2%, despite the fact i had developed products generating $500K in new income that particular year). This line of products was with a giant automotive company and the future looked really bright as we were becoming a large partner with this company.
I kept seeing QA personnel come in making twice as much as i was making all the while i had to teach them how to do their jobs! None of them lasted more than 3-4 months and i had to put my QA hat everytime to cover for this department.
I came to realize the only way to obtain true market value was by testing the market. Thus, I decided to leave the company to pursue other opportunities and i was able to use my experiences in this company to land a great job with excellent pay in the field i had always wanted to work in.
When it comes to the issue of money and raises i try to let my past performance and productivity speak for me during review time. If you do your job and contribute to the company the market will eventually reward you, that i can GUARANTEE. If you're not happy with your current pay, are not happy with your job, and have been contributing your share to the team this might be a good time to test the waters. If your boss doesn't realize your worth there is a company out there that will.
I kept seeing QA personnel come in making twice as much as i was making all the while i had to teach them how to do their jobs! None of them lasted more than 3-4 months and i had to put my QA hat everytime to cover for this department.
I came to realize the only way to obtain true market value was by testing the market. Thus, I decided to leave the company to pursue other opportunities and i was able to use my experiences in this company to land a great job with excellent pay in the field i had always wanted to work in.
When it comes to the issue of money and raises i try to let my past performance and productivity speak for me during review time. If you do your job and contribute to the company the market will eventually reward you, that i can GUARANTEE. If you're not happy with your current pay, are not happy with your job, and have been contributing your share to the team this might be a good time to test the waters. If your boss doesn't realize your worth there is a company out there that will.
3% is common here in the USA.
Chris
SolidWorks 07 3.0/PDMWorks 07
AutoCAD 06
ctopher's home (updated 04-21-07)
Chris
SolidWorks 07 3.0/PDMWorks 07
AutoCAD 06
ctopher's home (updated 04-21-07)
- Thread starter
- #15
ajack1, we get paid a percentage of the construction cost so our revenue increases with inflations. High gas prices are great for our market.
30osk, I agree, for him to tell me inflation was -1.5% really has me concerned. I currently have 10 yrs experience, sorry I didn't explain that in my post.
fcsuper, my thoughts exactly but he can't comprehend that a 1.8% raise is a decrease.
I have 10 yrs experience and I don't make 100k. In my area the market value is 65k. I started asking around about salaries and 3 firms have contacted me. I make 57k and would be happy with that if I was getting decent raises. My boss said that if we got 3-4% raises every year then in 10 years we would be making 100k. If I wasn't doing a good job I wouldn't mind but my evaluations make me think I am doing a great job. None of my co-workers are getting big raises. He gave everyone $0.50 per hour more. I really appreciate all of your responses.
30osk, I agree, for him to tell me inflation was -1.5% really has me concerned. I currently have 10 yrs experience, sorry I didn't explain that in my post.
fcsuper, my thoughts exactly but he can't comprehend that a 1.8% raise is a decrease.
I have 10 yrs experience and I don't make 100k. In my area the market value is 65k. I started asking around about salaries and 3 firms have contacted me. I make 57k and would be happy with that if I was getting decent raises. My boss said that if we got 3-4% raises every year then in 10 years we would be making 100k. If I wasn't doing a good job I wouldn't mind but my evaluations make me think I am doing a great job. None of my co-workers are getting big raises. He gave everyone $0.50 per hour more. I really appreciate all of your responses.
"...I have 10 yrs experience and I don't make 100k. In my area the market value is 65k. I started asking around about salaries and 3 firms have contacted me. I make 57k and would be happy with that if I was getting decent raises..."
I talked to a MS student the other day who just took a structural job in Charlotte that will pay around $60k. I know guys in Nashville who started over $50k in the last year or so. I have to think $57k is extremely low for 10 years of experience anywhere in the USA.
I talked to a MS student the other day who just took a structural job in Charlotte that will pay around $60k. I know guys in Nashville who started over $50k in the last year or so. I have to think $57k is extremely low for 10 years of experience anywhere in the USA.
The question is not what an engineer should be making now with 10yrs experience. The question is what an engineer with 10yrs experience should be making IN TEN YEARS. So look up what an engineer with 20 years experience makes today and add 10 years of inflation. I think you'll find that to be comfortably over 100k.
-b
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- #18
A 1.8% raise is a cut in real income. There can only be 3 reasons for this cut:
- You're underachieving (or being currently overpaid if you like).
- The company can't afford it.
- The owners would rather maximise their own profit (in a short-sighted way).
I don't think you believe the first reason is valid therefore ask yourself if you want to work where either of the next 2 is the reason for your drop in income.
At $57k I would think money is tight, can you even live comfortably on less?
Also your boss's reasoning is somewhat disturbing. Do you trust him?
- You're underachieving (or being currently overpaid if you like).
- The company can't afford it.
- The owners would rather maximise their own profit (in a short-sighted way).
I don't think you believe the first reason is valid therefore ask yourself if you want to work where either of the next 2 is the reason for your drop in income.
At $57k I would think money is tight, can you even live comfortably on less?
Also your boss's reasoning is somewhat disturbing. Do you trust him?
johnsmith2
Mechanical
The salary is dependent on the location. For high cost of living, such as CA, 56K is low. But, at Texas, this amount is good.
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I seems your boss is basically a liar, and a poor one at that. You may well have got a good evaluation but that means nothing. Face it, they'll say anything to keep you sweet. What counts is what is put on the table, and for you a lower than inflation pay-rise is a cut in your standard of living., or basically a pay cut in real terms. For your boss to say that if he kept on giving you 3% pay-rises would mean you earn 100k in so many tears, sounds like the old insurance/pension salesman technique and neatly avoids the fact that prices have also gone up in that time. If inflation was also 3% then basically you'll have gone nowhere and that 100k is worth just the same as today. You can of course tolerate a lower than inflation pay-rise for a short period bearing in mind the company's position but if someone tries to fool you by saying we're in a period of deflation then I wouldn't believe any comments they make as to the company's position either.
corus
corus
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