Starting new job mid-career - What advice to learn from my past? 9

[ParabolicTet]

I got laid off after spending 16 years as an engineer at a Fortune 100 company. I was never into leadership, so remained an "individual contributor". My job career was unique in that for many years I hardly had enough work to do. It was a combination of laid back bosses and go-getter co-workers who enjoyed doing everything themselves. I also never could really connect with my co-workers. Most came from small towns and had nothing better to do or talk about than work. To me it seemed they were always "busy doing nothing". For the last five years of my career I worked from home in a much bigger city nearby.

My job was providing high-end technical support to R&D engineers. But I would make it clear to people I was not there to hold their hands. They had to have a basic understanding of things and it was not my job to teach them that. With this attitude I minimized a lot of unnecessary work. At the same time, some folks may have seen me as "unapproachable". So it was a delicate balance trying to please the power users without offending the newbies.

As a result I invested my spare time in a side-business, managing rental properties and churning credit cards. I also invested my time reading up on investing and taxes.

Anyways, I've been unemployed for 7 months, but will be starting a new job soon. I want to start things on a new leaf. What advise would you have for succeeding in corporate jobs? From my experience, one should never say NO to anyone's request. The challenge with this is you get overloaded and spread yourself too thin. How does one manage that successfully?

My side-business has shrunken a lot so I no longer spend much time on it. I recently hired a property manager for my rentals, so that has taken a load off me. Last, credit card churning is almost done as banks have all cracked down on it. So I have plenty of time to devote to my new career!

 

[MikeHalloran]

I'd have 'laid you off' myself, not least for starting a sentence with "Anyways..".

Other suggestions for your new leaf:

Don't let anyone at work know you have a side business.
Better, don't have one.
At the very least, never conduct side business on your main business' premises.
This includes not answering the cell phone that you use for the side business.

Don't brag about your credit card churning.
Don't even mention it.
It doesn't reflect well on your character.

When you get busy, get efficient; find ways to make yourself more effective.
That does not include refusing to help people who need it.
Hold hands, if that's what it takes to get >your customers< up to speed.




Mike Halloran
Pembroke Pines, FL, USA

 

[jari001]

Are you taking the same/similar role you had at your previous company. It sounds from your post that you didn't enjoy the service part of the "customer service" role you were in. If you weren't willing to ramp up your competitiveness for work compared to your colleagues, then you should look for a work culture that is also laid back. If you didn't want to become like your coworkers, I can respect your choice but you need to recognize that if you go back into a fast paced environment and don't ramp up, you will get fired ASAP (maybe a bit of hyperbole, but only a bit).

It's not never saying no, its about proving why when you are saying no there is a very good reason AND giving an alternative solution. I will admit, most times people will give some reason why they can't/won't do something, but at least offering some solution will show people you are willing to invest in their success. As MikeHalloran said, hold hands if that is what is needed to have your customers succeed. Their success is your success. You need to have a semi-decent relationship with your manager, because they'll have to go to bat for you sometimes when you say no. Take the time to cultivate the relationship; you don't need to be friends, but you do need to trust each other.

 

[ParabolicTet]

Thanks. The new job is very similar to the previous role except there are far fewer users . Before I was supporting 500+ engineers. In this new role it will be 1-200 max. Also the new job is in a big metropolitan city, whereas the old one was in a smallish city. I am hopeful it will have co-workers that I can have an easier time interacting with. I am also hopeful the new job will have far fewer folks who expect constant hand-holding.

 

[Terratek]

If one person is having problems with many people; what is the most like issue?

1)the many people?
2)geographical setting?
3)the one person?

Maybe all/most outside factors will turn to your favor and this similar job will, on its own accord, be a better experience for you.

 

[NorthCivil]

Terratek,

to paraphrase: If you wake up one day and meet one Adolf, well, you met an Adolf. If you wake up one morning and everyone you meet is an Adolf, well... who's really the Adolf?

 

[ParabolicTet]

Only a couple of replies and already Godwin's Law proved true!

I said 10-15% of users I deal with are challenging , not everyone. Surely we all have aspects of our job that we consider not to be in our job duties. For example, one of my duties was supporting FEA software ( installation, optimizing, opening bug reports with vendor ). Is it my job also to teach users how to use FEA? No, but many engineers who never took a university course on FEA would expect that.

Similarly, another duty of mine was helping people get their code to run in a high performance computing environment. Is it my duty to teach people who know nothing about coding how to code? No, I would send those folks links to google some tutorial. Still some engineers would inherit code from a colleague who left. Then they would give it to me to maintain.

Last, another duty of mine was creating accounts for users on a Linux environment. Many of these folks only had Windows experience. Am I supposed to hand-hold everyone and teach them how to use Linux? No, that is their responsibility. But still many users expected a lot of hand holding because they had no clue how Linux works.

 

[oldestguy]

I've had guys with the attitude that you expressed about "It's not my job to do ....". Your posts are full of "It's not my job" statements. I can only state that guys with that attitude I had in my charge never got far. Those that dug in and did more than expected really progressed. Note the stars on some of the posts, indicating engineers who have seen a lot and you might do well to re-think your attitude and use that advice or comments to advantage..

I also know of one person person with high IQ who was laid off for "It ain't my job" attitude and eventually hung himself.

 

[Terratek]

ParabolicTet,

To be fair, you made what appeared to be a full disclosure that may be the truth for many, but that to which many would not admit, in what I assumed to be an earnest desire to get some real advice. I hope you do get along better at your new post. My experience is that self awareness goes a long distance in providing contentment, regardless of what I am doing. Not a cure all, but a big help. I would also only start worrying about whose job was what if my schedule was full and it was necessary for optimizing my schedule. In a situation like what you described from your past, it sounds like you had plenty of time to hold hands. If that is the case, then yes, you should hold hands. If you are booked up with work, then you have to start prioritizing who gets your help and who doesn't.

 

[oldestguy]

Here is one way to really make your mark, so to speak. Assuming some of those you need a little basic education in their jobs, think about how you might approach management and have them set aside some time for a class, say the last hour on Thursdays. Extending the time into the evening (on your time and theirs) would really do something for both you and the "class". It is these initiative acts that may not seem important, but good management will take note.

 

[DavidKite]

ParabolicTet,

I'm sure you are a smart guy and your perception is accurate. Even so, it might be worth while to exercising some compassion to those you intact with. As jari001 said "their success is your success". You may think they are not deserving of it but there can be sincere satisfaction in helping those who are capable as well as those who are not.

Good luck in your new job.

 

[rotw]

Think about it in this way: try to envision your next journey as if you are in a merciless environment (you are on Mars - red and dusty, no oxygen). A vision that will make your previous journey so far look like a real vacation in the Caribbean sea/ drinks and bikinis... Due to micro/macro economic factors, aspects intrinsic to the new firm, whatsoever reasons - what is coming next is light years away harder than what you've experienced till date - we are talking about targets, expectations, tribal knowledge, processes, insufficient support or training, blatant unfairness, etc. Any indulgence you've been accustomed to has now been withdrawn - you are on your own. What will you do?

I think this is the mindset you need to adapt when you build your personal strategies. Let me be more clear: Your survival is at play.
If you do not develop awareness / readiness to face next steps in a context that has turned 180 degree opposite to what you are used to then all the aggressive/unforgivable/harsh features of the upcoming journey will knock you out.

You are asking what should I do to get less wet when there will be another rain shower... I am saying you need to build barricades, erect strong walls and have fall backs and exit plans in place to prepare for the big flood!

 

[DavidKite]

Rotw,

It's a dog-eat-dog world out there but a predominant scarcity mindset is detrimental. To come back from multiple setbacks you listed, I believe it's better to have a growth mindset to accept and seek to do things better. Happiness in life can coexist in a merciless environment.

 

[drawoh]

ParabolicTet,

Sometimes, things are not your department. A good case can be made for not explaining FEA to idiots. How was it decided what level of qualification your co-workers had with FEA, coding and Linux? Who was responsible for providing the original training to everyone? If you don't like providing support, you should work at providing support.

When my duties included the administration of a UNIX network, I spent a lot of downtime writing manuals and other instructions. When you are busy and you want to tell them to RTFM, you need an FM!



--
JHG

 

[GregLocock]

Interesting choice of phrase. Not many engineers are idiots. I've known support desk blockers like the OP, casting their pearls of wisdom on swine, frankly they are in the wrong job.

Cheers

Greg Locock


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[Jboggs]

ParabolicTet, you remind me of a few people I have worked with over the years. All very good engineers in their own right, but simply either had no clue about, no patience for, or no interest in the deeper truths of working with other people. I have spent my whole career picturing my employer and all my co-workers as my customers. If couldn't help them with their problem I would go out of my way to try to point them in a helpful direction. I didn't do that with the attitude of "trying to get them off my back". I did it with the attitude of "I want them to think of me the next time they need help." I think that attitude is the main reason I have remained employed while other heads were dropping around me. You spent a lot of time defining what "is not my job". How much time did you spend trying to define exactly what your job is? I can tell you right now its not to provide "engineering services". It is to help people solve their problems. Oftentimes that job might involve some engineering skills. But more often it will involve taking an interest in actually helping. It doesn't really take a huge leap in understanding to realize that attitude is in your own best interest.

I realize that I'm probably talking about MAJOR personality changes. But you asked in a forthright manner, so I will answer in the same way.

One other thing that struck me is that you seemed to spend a lot of time trying to avoid work, and seemed proud when you did so. I would not be proud of that. If you don't enjoy your work, find some you do.

 

[drawoh]

GregLocock,

If you respect someone's knowledge and ability, they are not idiots.

--
JHG

 

[ParabolicTet]

Thanks, there is some good advice that I will work on following in my new job.

I still have issues with helping people who really need to help themselves. It makes me cringe to see someone with a bachelors degree doing complex FEA/CFD. It's part of a growing trend of "democratization" of simulation.

In university one has to take pre-requisites before they let you enroll in an advanced class. No professor is going to hold your hand to teach you things you are expected to know. Why in corporate world is it any different?

 

[MikeHalloran]

Because CAD drivers with an AS work cheaper than engineers with a BS and much cheaper than PhDs.

Further, some of the damn software has 'engineer' in the name, so that must be what it does, at least according to MBAs.



Mike Halloran
Pembroke Pines, FL, USA

 

[GregLocock]

Treating the workplace as if it was like it should be in your opinion, rather than as it is, is rarely going to have a great outcome.

So, if a significant proportion of your customers request basic support put together a solution. I created a wiki that attempts to capture all of the weirder aspects of doing my job (not in FEA).

As to whether you need anything beyond a BEng to run FEA, that rather depends on what you are doing. A far greater danger is FEA analysts who believe the model is right and the test result is wrong, or who have little physical understanding of the system in question. My background is in experimental modal analysis, to reveal my prejudices.

Cheers

Greg Locock


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