Structural engineers: Should I specialize in bridges or buildings? 2

[mikipetri74]

I'll be entering the workforce soon and from what I've heard, structural engineers either work with bridges or buildings, not both usually. I am more interested in buildings but it seems like bridges might be a better idea since they are more necessary than some new building and therefore recession-proof (though not if everyone begins specializing in them I suppose). Thoughts on this?

 

[skeletron]

Buildings. I don't like moving loads.

 

[WARose]

If you can find a place to do both....that would be ideal. But I will say this: in more than 20+ years of doing this.....I have yet to meet a unemployed bridge engineer. I've sat at the table with as many a dozen unemployed (building) structural engineers. I once had a recruiter offer me 1k if I could just give him the name of a unemployed bridge engineer.

'nuff said

 

[phamENG]

To a point, you are correct. Most of the bridge engineers I know work for the DOT. There are a handful of firms in my area that consult for DOT's or municipalities to actually design the bridges. Those firms had minimum qualifications for entry level positions set very high when I came out of school. I put in for one of them, and I didn't get an interview. I called the office manager and asked why - entry level bridge engineers at that company are required to have a master's degree and a minimum of 2 years experience in bridge engineering. Intern time could be put toward that, as well as bridge inspections. So...I went to a firm that designs buildings. I'm happy I did. Even in a recession, structural engineers are still in demand. It's just a matter of staying diverse and flexible enough to keep the phone ringing.

 

[Enhineyero]

Congratulations! Going after what interest you is a good start but also consider other important factors, like say working conditions (do you want to work 60+ hrs no overtime pay?), compensation (do you wish to work in a almost-no-profit business? see 'Engineer Business Practices issues'), spend lots of your time in CPD/CPE, and overall lifestyle (Do you prefer a relaxed life style? balanced life style? or engineering-is-my-life lifestyle?)

 

[r13]

If you like to stay in a job through retirement, the bridge engineering offers better opportunity. The building engineering offers broader markets, easier to get in, but it is much challenging - in finding the next job during economic downturns.

 

[dik]

I don't think I specialised in anything... I love different projects. I started out in Geological engineering... did all my work in Hydraulics and Hydrology... and have worked in structures for the last 50+ years...

Rather than think climate change and the corona virus as science, think of it as the wrath of God. Feel any better?

-Dik

 

[Tomfh]

I’m in buildings. I’d have preferred bridges, but couldn’t find a way to get in when I graduated.

 

[NorthCivil]

The bridge engineers I know are in high demand by mostly big companies, with opportunity to travel around the world, and cushy salaries.

Building structural engineering is mostly dominated by small businesses, and big businesses that have to compete with small lean businesses (not many guys are getting rich).

Buildings can be lucrative if you get into a niche specialty. There is more money in the bits and pieces attached to the building than there is in the primary structure.

If I could do it all over again i would have stuck to civil, geotechnical, roading, infrastructure, hydro, anything else than structural. It's just too competitive

 

[STrctPono]

I don't know much about buildings but from a Bridge Engineer's perspective that works for a small private consulting firm I can offer some advice.

In the US:
1. If you do get a job designing bridges, you will most likely either end up working for the State DOT or for a large private consulting firm. Getting in with a large consulting firm such as International Bridge Technologies, HNTB, or T.Y. Lin would be awesome but extremely difficult.
2. Bridge design jobs are harder to get because there are fewer of them (compared to buildings) and can sometimes be politically connected via Civil Engineering firms who get larger contracts for new/widening road projects. The more corrupt your city/country is the more true this statement will be.
3. In my city, the firm I work for is the only structural engineering firm out of (~30) that focus entirely on bridge design. There are 2 others that try and do bridges but half their operation is still focused on buildings. Most everyone else is either buildings or military work. I know many of those firms would kill to get the chance to design some highway bridges.
4. In my city, when recessions hit, the building guys furlough or lay off half their staff. Our firm has never been slow in the 9 years that I've been working here. In fact, during recessions, pumping money into infrastructure projects is how the States/Feds try and jump start economies.

I would agree that most people choose a discipline within Structural Engineering and stick with it. There is so much information to learn that I cannot understand how someone can try and do it all. If you do I imagine that you will end up being a jack of everything and a master of nothing.

 

[JedClampett]

I said this on another thread. But there is a world of structural engineering beyond bridges and buildings. In college, structural engineers are led to believe that that's all there is. Granted, these are niche industries where you have to train on the job, but they'll keep you employed and interested.
Examples:
[ul]
[li]Water and Wastewater (you do buildings, but many specialized structures, also).[/li]
[li]FRP (tanks and systems)[/li]
[li]Glass, window framing and Glazing[/li]
[li]Equipment Anchorage[/li]
[li]Pipe Supports[/li]
[li]Precast/Prestressed[/li]
[li]Etc.[/li]
[/ul]

 

[bridgebuster]

When I was in college, I thought I'd become a building guy but the economy in the late 70's wasn't very good and most of the available jobs were government or pipe supports. I took a job with a city DOT; pay was very good $13.5K and 4 weeks vacation to start; $14.5 after 6 months; $18.5 after one year. 35 hour work week. I left after 2.5 years; didn't like being a paper pusher. I went to a small bridge outfit and have been in the private sector ever since. Over time through mergers & acquisitions I'm with an extremely large company but it doesn't compare with the first company; that was the best place I ever worked.

I don't have any regrets with bridge work; there have been some slow times but I was always employed. The work has been interesting. It hasn't always been bridge design; some building work, pipe supports, utility poles, lighting design, etc. As we say, "I can do anything, I'm a bridge engineer."

 

[MIStructE_IRE]

The whole reason i got into structural engineering was because I thought bridges were so cool...

Now 200 home renovation projects, countless reports and 200 office developments later.. here i am...

 

[MIStructE_IRE]

Ps, bridges are not recession proof. Your government will decide what’s essential during a recession and a quicker/easier way to get to the shops is not high up there on the list..

At least with buildings you have a much wider variety of clients. Nothing is recession proof, but with buildings there’s more baskets in which to place the eggs..

 

[dhengr]

Mikipetri74:
My goodness, the list is almost endless, if you look beyond bridges and buildings. There are industrial bldgs. and structures, hoppers, conveyors, pressure vessels and piping and their supports. Wood handling, chipping, saw milling, etc. Given your handle and (Agricultural)…, every piece of farming or forestry equipment has to be structurally designed and manufactured efficiently. Contractors, fabricators, and the like need good structural engineers. Some of these areas involves some mechanical and industrial engineering too. But, you can pick that up fairly quickly, on the job, if you got a good handle on the engineering basics. Look at any industry which designs and builds a product or piece of equipment. And, then get out their and start meeting people to see what they do and if they need a good engineer who can adapt his engineering knowledge to new situations. Partly, you do this through professional associations you participate in. How many engineers do you know? What do they actually do (ask them) and where do they work? One thing to keep in mind if you eventually want to become a registered P.E., is that you generally have work under a more experienced registered engineer for some period of time before you can sit for the registration exams.

 

[STrctPono]

Ps, bridges are not recession proof. Your government will decide what’s essential during a recession and a quicker/easier way to get to the shops is not high up there on the list..

At least with buildings you have a much wider variety of clients. Nothing is recession proof, but with buildings there’s more baskets in which to place the eggs..

I agree with a lot of what you say. They are not recession proof, however, many times (not always) government entities are operating with budgets that had money allocated from either the previous year or even before. Federal aid, which is typically always required on large transportation projects, has been allocated early on in the project's programming. What is happening with the economy has less effect on bridges than buildings. What is happening with politics has a much greater effect on bridges.

You are spot on with buildings having a much wider variety of clients. 75% of the work in our office is either coming directly or indirectly from the same client. Your relationship with these key personnel in the government is critical. If you piss the wrong person off you could really black ball your firm out of a lot of work in the future.

This latest "recession" is a completely different animal and is affecting government and private money sources alike so we will see in the next few years but I'm not feeling too hopeful about the reverberating consequences due to everything that has been happening the past year.

 

[kostast88]

Bridges

Pros
More Money, better work life balance (by far),you can plan not only your week but your entire month, excellent if you want to pursue other goals (family, learn an instrument,travel). More international role if you end up in the right team. No architects. Number crunching engineering - we get to the bottom of it.

Cons
Working on the same project for months can be pretty boring, at early career you get stuck with inspections. When you design you follow standard details all the time and you are not much of an engineer in this regard. Authorities know what they want and how they want it, they are just looking for people to do the work. So practically no creativity.

Verdict: I found the best engineers in Bridges + international experts and at the same time I found people who don't know how to solve a simply supported beam with a point load in the middle. Also, I never saw a bridge engineer sketching anything at all, they usually draw lines in MS powerpoint. All these people mixed together will be your team in Bridges. You have to become a team player in this line of work.

Buildings

Pros
More interesting concepts, room for creativity and freedom of design. With the right experience and guidance you could acquire everything you need t start your own firm.

Cons
Work-life balance is horrible, architects change their minds a lot so plenty of re-work. Projects don't last that long unless you are on a big building or a scheme of multiple similar buildings where things are repetitive. Not very accurate engineering.

Verdict: More interesting Concepts (endless possibilities) but no time or budget to work them properly. People tend to be more arrogant and selfish in this line of work, unlike the team-feel of Bridge Engineers. So if you are a strong personality you could thrive better here without restraining your character too much. That could also help you with clients and architects.


A lot of the cons on Bridges don't come from the Bridges themselves but from the Big Company factor. So if you find a small firm that does Bridges (rare) I would go for that. You would satisfy your Engineering curiosity, and be creative at the same time. They pay better on smaller firms and you could get the right tools to start your own business one day.

 

[structuralCADspecialist]

I've worked on the client side in bridges and the consultant side of buildings (in 4 different firms).

Most of the comments are very on point. I will add that some consulting firms also do bridges. One I know of would do both railway and highway bridges. Railway bridges were more likely to incorporate 'manual' methods where as highway bridge engineering tends to go the way of software assisted engineering (caveat: 10-year old advice - but back when I worked with railway bridges the AREMA manual and some nifty Excel sheets did the job well).

Everyone's correct in saying that Bridge engineering firms offer better salary, benefits, work/life balance. I won't comment much on that. I will only had (apologies if someone added this already) the fact that bridges form a much smaller piece of the pie compared to buildings. This is why it's so challenging to get on with a 'bridge' firm.

Buildings vary quite a bit themselves. The highest paying gigs tend to be with those that specialize in Industrial/Institutional. Someone once told me Industrial is way better because the Eng. essentially becomes the Architect almost; you get to decide where stuff goes or at least work with engineers in other disciplines. Way more rewarding and less wasted time because of bad Architectural decisions.

Next 'down' the list would be Commercial. Large commercial projects can be quite lucrative while smaller commercial projects start to blend in with residential. Large commercial projects can present a lot of fun and challenging engineering tasks that you won't encounter on smaller projects. The only reason why commercial (and industrial) buildings might not be a viable pathway for everyone is because they also form a relatively smaller piece of the pie compared to residential.

So at the 'bottom' of the list would be residential (let's say there's a 'basement' too - reno's and tenant improvements, but my post is already getting too long). Residential forms a huge part of engineering. It also pays the least because it is quite 'competitive'. In reality it's not so much that it's competitive rather than the clients want the cheapest fastest solutions. It can be incredibly unfulfilling if you're stuck working with a bad architect. Most offices are not management in the best way so expect to be handed 'fix-up' tasks when joining a new firm. In my area it's quite hard to be 'let go' from a structural firm specializing in residential. You'd either need a '2008 housing crisis' or someone in the bottom 5% talent wise for that to happen. Most people quit (maybe got a call from a 'bridge' firm). So why on earth would anyone do residential? Many don't have a choice. There are just so many jobs. Additionally, if you ever plan to migrate into project management, you'll have dealt with many different projects even after only a year or two. And of course, plenty of jobs exist. Each construction start requires a whole array of management staff. There is probably at least 100 residential starts to each industrial start. Probably even a bigger ratio compared to bridges. Another reasonable excuse to get into residential is if you want to start your own firm. Although it's 'competitive' it wouldn't be very hard to outperform most consulting offices. Most residential offices are quite disorganized. And those that aren't are usually top-heavy. It would be much harder to start your own firm specializing in larger projects however. I personally wouldn't recommend getting into residential unless you have some potential career paths plotted out.

One last thing that I'll note is that when it comes to residential, not all projects are equal (in terms of pay and headaches). The worst seemed to be townhouses, rowhouses, and mid-rise. Concrete towers would be in the middle somewhere. Luxury homes towards the top of the list. The quality of the Architect would play a huge role in how smoothly the project would go. I would say at least half of the projects that the firms I worked for turned a loss on were due to the Architects incompetence.

 

[HTURKAK]

Hi mikipetri74 ,


I will strongly advise you ; specialize in bridges !!!.. keep far a way from the architects..

 

[msquared48]

Regardless what you choose to do, don’t burn your bridges...

Mike McCann, PE, SE (WA, HI)