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SW2005 on XP x64 : Can it make use of the extra RAM?

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chriskh

chriskh

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"Windows XP Professional x64 Edition provides a rich platform to integrate 64-bit technical applications and existing 32-bit business applications using the Windows on Windows 64 (WOW64) x86 emulation layer, providing customers with the ability to move to 64-bit computing without having to sacrifice their existing investment in 32-bit software and Windows expertise."

In light of the above statement, has SolidWorks 2005 been tested on XP x64, and if it has, can it make use of the extended memory capacity of XP x64. SolidWorks is a 32bit application, so would it still be subject to the memory limits of a 2000/XP operating system within Xp x64? Is the extra memory only available to 64bit applications? I have selected an Athlon 64 motherboard which supports up to 8GB of RAM ( ) and before making this purchase, I need to know if I can make use of the extra RAM or not. I have also checked Nvidia's website, and there is driver support. (
 
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Scott can give you a better idea of the testing that has been done in the 64-bit format (to my knowledge, SW does not support it right now), but I would be more worried about stability and graphics card support. If you can't find anything explicit on the SW website that says it's supported, you're taking a gamble as to how well it will work.
 
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Hi PDMAdmin, Thank-you for the reply. I talked to SW tech support at least 6 months ago, and pretty much got the same reply. They also said that Microsoft's view on this is that software vendors just need to re-compile their source code to run on 64bit. SW said it would take 100's of staff working on this to do it, and it would mean virtually re-writing the code. Thats all acceptable, but [[[I'm more interested in whether it can run as a 32bit app, and whether it can obtain the extra memory which XP64 supports.]]] XP64 has been available for free for many months now, so I had hoped someone out their might have been curious too? My interest is seeing how areas like large assemblies, PW2 rendering, big vault checkins, 300+ feature model rebuilds, big IGES translations, Cosmos analysis etc will benefit from greater memory. Ultimately CPU speed, FSB and memory speed itself play a role in all of this, but I have read articles on how successful the XP 3GB switch has been, so I felt this was the next step beyond. I guess I should search for a user site linked to microsoft, and see what feedback there is from non-solidworks software users who have tried XP64.I'm sure other people out there must have tried this by now.
I guess the only way I'll find out is to buy the kit, and get XP64 installed. But I wanted to get as much feedback as possible before spending the bucks....
 
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64 bit Processors are not supported by SW, but there is no reason why they wouldn't work with SW. Although it's not been fully tested, so there is no guarantee the results of this. If you had problems there would be nothing anyone could do for you, because it's not support. With that said... See the bold text

I have heard this from SW, and you can decide for yourself because of the above statement - The Recommendation I got was for the AMD 64-Bit Processor to be used with SW.

It would be a good investment because SW will be supporting 64-bit in then ear future. However you should check out Google if you haven't already. This has been discussed there before (comp.cad.soildworks). Also remember the first statement in this post.

Regards,

Scott Baugh, CSWP [pc2]
3DVision Technologies
Merry Christmas [santa3]
faq731-376
faq559-716 - SW Fora Users
 
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cheers for the feedback guys. i think i'll just try it and see how i get on. i'll make sure i go for a cheap 64bit motherboard and cheaper chip, i.e not go for the AMD FX-55. i'll let you know how i get on, if i can get the cash sorted for the project. happy xmas too!
 
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SolidWorks is not compiled for 64 bit processors, nor is there 64 bit
operating system that we support...yet. Be sure to check the customer
bulletins for this type of announcement.
Click to expand...


That is an email I recieved from Solidworks when I asked them:
Does SolidWorks support AMD 64 Bit processors?

Is there increased perfomance with a 64 bit AMD?
Click to expand...


 
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Dear AAmoroso. Thanks for the input. I know SW isnt compiled for 64bit enviroment, but you can run 32bit apps on XP64 inside an emulator.

"Windows XP Professional x64 Edition provides a rich platform to integrate 64-bit technical applications and existing 32-bit business applications using the Windows on Windows 64 (WOW64) x86 emulation layer"

What I want to know is if SW2005 is installed on XP64, can it obtain more memory than the usual 1.6-1.7GB physical RAM before it starts to page to HDD, which happens with current 2000/XP. Apparently if you are running Windows Server 2003, the upper RAM limit allocated to individual apps goes up to 4GB. But, unfortunately, there isnt a free download of this, but there is for XPx64.
cheers, chriskh.
 
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Thanks Scott.The 3GB switch option has been available for some time (Whats new 2004), + I'm a greedy person, and I want more than 3GB. Knowing that theres hardware out there which will support up to 8Gb of RAM, I'm determained to work out if I can get to use all of it, and XPx64 gives me that opportunity. Initially I intend to be purchasing 2GB, but will be getting another 2GB the month after. The info I have on the 3Gb switch is below, a friend at work sent it to me, if anyone else finds it useful??

The Perils of Trying to Overcome the 2GB Memory Limit

By Ed Eaton

If you crash SolidWorks or PhotoWorks because of insufficient memory, purchasing more RAM for your computer is only part of the solution.

No matter how much memory you have, or how big your virtual memory, Windows will not allow you to use more than 2GB for a single application.

On top of that, the 2GB is theoretical. In practice, applications crash when memory usage reaches about 1.6-1.7 GB. This of course will stop you cold if you are working on large assemblies, or on PhotoWorks renderings.

Because of the 32-bit operating system, the mathematical limit for total memory+virtual memory is 4GB. By default, Windows reserves half of that total for itself!

On page 7-12 of the SW2004 "what's new manual," there is a mention that SolidWorks is written to take advantage of the /3GB switch. This switch allows Windows XP Pro and some server applications to override the 2GB limit and free up to 3GB of that expensive RAM you've been buying for your systems.

Unfortunately, when our company attempted to follow the instructions as presented, we permanently prevented our system from rebooting.

After a great deal of extra research, we found that enabling the 3GB switch requires that you know a poorly documented two-step process.

The first poorly documented problem is that the /3GB switch is not working in Windows XP Pro, Service pack 1 (that's why the system locked up)! To get a hotfix that corrects the issue, you have to call (800) 936-4900 and get to the "hotfix" people. Don't get spooked by Microsoft's statement that they will charge $245 for tech support - hotfixes are free.

Let the person on the phone know the problem has to do with the /3GB switch, referred to in article 328269. The link for that article is support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;en-us;328269&Product=winxp

Microsoft will email you a hotfix that carries no warranty and is not recommended for use in a production setting unless you thoroughly test it. But, for the record, it worked for us, and I have not experienced any problems in the three months I've had it on my machine.

After running the hotfix, enabling the /3GB switch is not as simple as checking a box in a dialogue. You have to dig into your boot.ini file and modify it.

The boot.ini file is on the top level of your C: drive, but to make it visible you have to go through Windows Explorer Options, Tools, Folder Options, View and select "Show hidden files and folders" and deselect "Hide protected operating system files."

The modification to the boot.ini file is explained in the following article:


The text of your boot.ini file may not match the sample shown. For reference, here is what I had to do to mine:

multi(0)disk(0)rdisk(0)partition(2)\WINDOWS="Microsoft Windows XP Professional" /3GB /fastdetect

A final warning: Yes, enabling the /3GB switch has worked for us, and allows us to use up to 2.7GB of RAM before locking up SolidWorks or PhotoWorks. We are now able to perform tasks that were simply not possible before the modification. But as with any time we hack our systems for performance, there are risks. Before starting on this process, I made a complete backup of my boot drive than I could plug in and use if things went south.
 
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It sounds more like you're interested in the OS side of things and less in the hardware side. Regarding 64-bit Windows OS, I think we've still got a mystery on our hands. How will the applications and hardware handle it? We would have to guess.

However, I've been using a 64-bit Opteron in two machines for almost a year now. Very stable, excellent systems--cheap, too. Check out Xi Computers for the best deals on pre-assembled systems. I checked with Fry's Electronics (retail) and found I could assemble the same system myself for $200 less, but I'd have to do all the assembling--and of course, there would be no support, etc. It wasn't worth the time and risk, so I went with Xi Computer.

You'll get a lot of advantage from the architecture of the motherboard--the bus systems are laid out in a way as to optimize bulk movement of data from one piece of hardware to another. Plus, you can take advantage of the SATA options for hard drives. My machine cost under $2,000 a year ago. You can trade that for a better chip now, and the computer companies might even cut better deals since we're in the last month of the year.

If you search this forum for 64-bit and my screen name, you'll find lots of posts with more details if that's what you're interested in finding.

Meanwhile, I highly recommend AMD these days. I'm not sure why Intel is making the colossal blunders with improved technology lately, but they're exhibiting some problems with innovation--and losing market share about as fast as Internet Explorer.

Jeff Mowry
Industrial Designhaus, LLC
 
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Sorry Jack3108, I've never been to the page myself, I just tried it too and couldnt find it either, MASSIVE SORRY. More digging on the microsoft website i think.

Theophilus, cheers for your input too. You're right, I am more interested in the OS side of things, because this is the key bit which hopefully will unlock getting access to more memory.
Thanks for the info, I'll do some searchs using your screen name.
 
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Good luck. There isn't much evidence available on the 64-bit OS with 32-bit software at this point. Maybe you could post your findings if you go for it? That would be helpful, since the CAD magazines and others haven't done any significant benchmarking of such systems yet.

Jeff Mowry
Industrial Designhaus, LLC
 
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Hi Guys, if you are still reading this thread. I have got a bottomn line answer on this subject. Sw2005 will not install correctly on XPx64 because it has trouble populating the registry. If you are looking to use more memory then you must stick to XP Pro and enable the 3Gb switch.
best regards
chriskh
 
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Hi Scott, I got a reply back from SW tech support in Concord. I was told that the address space overhead is bigger in a 64-bit OS, and this may not give any real benefit compared to running 32-bit SolidWorks on a 32-bit OS with the 3GB switch enabled. However they are still investigating this, but as XP64 isn't production-ready, they wouldn't be supporting SolidWorks on a non-released OS.

best regards
chriskh
 
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