Tapping into Power from Wall Outlet Receptacle? 1

[metalman8357]

Hello All,

I am working on a product that will be an actively powered face plate for a wall outlet receptacle. Basically the socket will provide power for my faceplate and I need to tap into the power of the outlet. There is a company that makes an active face plate (

) and they use a patented clip out of the back of the faceplate to make contact with the terminal screws on the outlet to provide power. I would love to use this mechanism to power my face plate but unfortunately the mechanism is patented!

The simplest method would be to just use two wires out of the back of the face plate and have an open ring terminal on the end of the wires that could be used to slip under the existing screw terminal that holds the mains power lines (

). Unfortunately I've been told that this configuration would violate the electrical code which prohibits two wires being used on the same screw terminal?

I am not well versed on the code but basically I need a way to attach my Hot and Neutral wires from my actively powered faceplate into the existing wall socket without infringing on the patent as discussed previously. Is there a simple solution I'm just not seeing?

Any input would be helpful!

 

[metalman8357]

Thanks Lionel for your thorough response. I suspect you are right in that many homeowners are not going to want to fuss with wiring an outlet but I do believe that my product will be worth it to many.

As for the wire tails out of the back attaching to the existing screw terminals; can I contact UL to learn their position on this issue. I'd hate to spend my time with product development pursuing this solution when they won't approve it in the first place. Will they answer questions like this for product designers?

 

[stevenal]

FreddyNurk,

Yes the screw terminals are on the sides, usually with back stabs behind them. Removing the receptacle while energized is not advised, although I have seen it done.

 

[LionelHutz]

You will probably have to open a preliminary listing project with UL to get answers. Besides, once you do that then you are dealing with the engineer in charge of the listing and the decisions will become part of the final listing so the answer is final. Otherwise, you might get 2 different people with 2 different answers between you asking the question and you trying to get a listing.

The other way I didn't mention is to just list it as being installed on the extra free screws and let the installer do it wrong anyways. If your tails were solid 14 or 16 gauge wire then they could either plug into the back quick connect holes or be installed to the screws.

 

[jraef]

I'll just warn you that in the residential electrician's world, the use of back stabbing is considered taboo. It's there for the DIY crowd, but no self respecting electrician will use them. They deal with the aftermath.

This site is primarily engineers. If you want an installers opinion, I suggest posting to Electriciantalk.com or Mike Holt's forum.


"You measure the size of the accomplishment by the obstacles you had to overcome to reach your goals" -- Booker T. Washington

 

[itsmoked]

Intertek is a National Testing Lab that competes with UL and who's stamp is equivalent to UL's. I'd use them instead of UL whenever possible. They're faster, less expensive, and a little less self-important acting.

The reason I bring this up is because they had a "lunch questions" program where you could talk to an engineer for 30 minutes with any questions for free or really cheap, I can't remember the exact offer now. It was for getting your type questions answered.

Keith Cress
kcress -

http://www.flaminsystems.com

 

[HCBFlash]

Leads with stripped ends is really the only practical option. The installer will have to determine the connections.

Many DIY types will put them in without a second thought, Many DIY types couldn't care less about any NRTLs either, but you'll need to do that if you hope to survive.

I wish the "push-wire Taboo" were reality, I've replaced dozens of push wired receptacles, and could show you thousands in the time it would take to walk over and pull the plates off. They're even using push-wire wire nuts now in the USA, and I'd gladly name contractors and workers, and I'm talking about commercial occupancies.

Push-wire is insecure, unsafe, irresponsible, unwise, immoral, and as legal as the day is long. So get your NRTL, your own committee, your own new section in the NEC, and do whatever the f*** you want! Have 'em made in China too. That's how it's done these days.

.


Me wrong? I'm just fine-tuning my sarcasm!

 

[LionelHutz]

Yes, tons of electricians back-stab out of necessity to remain competitive. If they don't then the extra time to terminate prices them out of the job.

 

[jfpe]

Is the goal of the product just to add a 5VDC USB charger to a receptacle? There are several USB Charger/120VAC receptacles already on the market. Are looking at ease of installation by putting it in the face plate?

JFPE