techinques in training/mentoring 7

[Denob]

I am starting research on a report and powerpoint presentation. The topic is going to be about the proper way of training/teaching novice engineers. Basically, there's been a problem at my work place when it comes to training, or lack thereof, new engineers. Project managers are giving projects to new engineers without any type of mentoring. They give the engineer a "go-by" and expect the project to be done correctly and within budget. Problem is, these engineers have to teach themselves new concepts and invariably eat up the budget doing so.

Are there good resources out there on this topic? Any comments or advice? For example,Step 1: Teach the "big picture" of what this project is about. Step 2: Explain more specific concepts and go through some sample calculations....etc., etc.

Thank you!

 

[epoisses]

IMHO there's no substiture for hands-on training, i.e. learning by doing. You can't expect a novice to perform like an experienced engineer from day 1 just by providing the right training, it's not as easy as that. What can be done is make young engineers participate in a project team where they can learn from their experienced colleagues, but for smaller projects you can't afford the luxury of putting several engineers on the job. In that case the rookie can only learn the hard way.

Cf: you can't learn to ride a bike by just teaching the "big picture" of what riding a bike is about, you learn it by crashing into things all the time.... but less and less and less...

 

[zcp]

I think the number one thing to include is a "here's a typical project at our company: step by step". Then walk through 1) how a project is assigned 2) how to gather the background data 3) responsibilities 4) etc.

Then include the most important thing of all to anyone new at any company......."here are the tools / forms / resources / where to go for help / who to go to for help / what to do in case of problems / etc. that you will use to complete your project". Don't forget to include a "here's how to close out and document a project".

ZCP

http://www.phoenix-engineer.com

 

[TheTick]

Perhaps if employee reviews were done in a top-down order. That way a manager is rated for his subordinates' improvement before his subordinates are slammed for not learning what they are not taught.

Either a company takes mentoring seriously or it doesn't. It has more to do with culture than procedure.

 

[PSE]

I would echo some comments by both zcp and TheTick. A company wishing to have successful novice engineers needs to make the commitment to support them. A green engineer given sink or swim "training" is always going to flounder around for a bit. While they have (hopefully) the technical basics, not only do they need to learn from reality vs theory, but they also need to know how to work with and interact with departments and individuals outside the technical arena. Effective communication I believe is key. This goes beyond following the procedures and using the right forms to developing a "feel" for how the company operates. Who needs what, by when, and why for a project can create the framework for teaching how it is done.

Regards,

 

[arunmrao]

It is always good to teach anyone the Don'ts. This way they will learn better and there will be fewer mishaps or slips. I do this often in my plant,to an extent I teach them how to walk/stand in the plant,which places to avoid /be careful etc.

If they can be made a team member great contributions can be had from the young. They are always energetic ,cheerful and seek recognition or identification. I too would crave for such opportunities as young engineer,but then I learnt the hard way.

 

[denoid]

From my own personal observations, you can't make someone be a mentor who doesn't want to mentor. Many people call themselves Project Managers who have no idea how to mentor or want to learn. They like to monitor the numbers, and blame someone else when the budget goes to hell. Mentoring involves caring about not only the project, but the success of all of the people working on it.

I'm not sure it was the best way, but my own mentoring happened by people who watched out for themselves by keeping an eye on me in the process. They never sat me down and gave me lectures about office policies and procedures. What they did do, however, was to say to me:

"I know you're new and green and don't know everything. I can't watch you for 8 hours per day because I have my own work to do. I know you're an intelligent person, so you should know when you don't know something. When that time comes, come and ask me, and I'll tell you what I know about it. If I don't know, I'll tell you that too. I don't know everything either, and sometimes you have to research things to find out. Sometimes I'll come to ask you things, because I don't know, or I'll want a second opinion."

I appreciated the honesty, and that I was being treated like an equal. That went a long way in making me step up to the plate and take some responsibility in my own mentoring. That's how I try to mentor younger engineers in my office these days. It sure worked for me!

 

[jvo1]

I still am pretty much a novice engineer. I must repeat what epoisses said, "there's no substiture for hands-on training", you must get your feet wet to swim. The biggest compliment to this, is having a mentor type engineer who is very patient (big key) that can answer questions and check work. There's a lot of times I solve problems and get stuff done, but just dont have enough experience to be 100% confident -- having someone to check and either confirm my approach and give slight variation recommendations, or correct me and point me in the right direction in a non-harmful way. As arunmrao said, "They are always energetic ,cheerful and seek recognition or identification". I think that translates to, we are very eager to work, have lots of ideas, but just lack the general knowledge to get everything done on our own. Give us the project, but provide a resource (friendly, mentor type engineer) for when we need them and let us run with it. You wont be disappointed.

 

[jvo1]

After re-reading the whole thread, just wanted to reiterate my point: the problem is just uncertainty due to lack of experience. A lot of times everything can be saved by just a 2 minute question. Provide a human (mentor) resource in engineering. Encourage them to talk to assembly, welders, etc and get their opinion on how to do things. Nothing beats experience.

 

[HgTX]

I know you're new and green and don't know everything. I can't watch you for 8 hours per day because I have my own work to do. I know you're an intelligent person, so you should know when you don't know something. When that time comes, come and ask me, and I'll tell you what I know about it. If I don't know, I'll tell you that too. I don't know everything either, and sometimes you have to research things to find out. Sometimes I'll come to ask you things, because I don't know, or I'll want a second opinion.

Perfect.

Hg


Eng-Tips policies: faq731-376

 

[Ashereng]

The search for the proper way to train novice ______.

Everyone one of us here at one point or another has gone through a learning process. Not just to become an engineer, technician, professional, etc. - but learned
how to ride a bike - age 5
how to do an assignment - grade 9
how to pass college, trade school - age 18 - ?

And, we probably all learned it in not quite identical way.

There are some ways that we liked. Some we really didn't like. Some of us are more hands on. Others are more thought oriented. There is book smart. There is worldly smart. All are valuable.

There is probably no single "proper" way to teach someone (jut look at the number of different coaches in any sport). But, there are probably lots of "improper" way to teach a specifc individual.

You probably need to tailor the approach to the individual (just look at the number of different approaches coaches uses with different players).

That is why training someone is so hard - and why many corporations do not do it well.

I paraphrase something someone once said:

"If it is easy, then everyone would be doing it."

 

[UcfSE]

When explaining how things work, whether it is technical or otherwise, try to avoid the "that's just how we do it" reason. That's just dumb and offers nothing to help the new guy learn, but instead shows him that no one knows why this standard detail is used instead of another one, or no one cares.

Learn by doing. Let the new guy fill out paper work for a new project. Give him or her simple things to engineer and work up from there. Let them walk before they have to run.

 

[epoisses]

Denob,
Make sure you refer to EngTips and especially to the "Best Engineering Advice" thread in your report

 

[SomptingGuy]

It strikes me that there are two distinct things a green engineer needs to know:

1) Where and how to find information and procedures for getting things done. These are site-specific and can't be deduced.

2) How to solve technical/engineering problems. This cannot be taught. It comes with experience.

 

[myhonda]

Denob,
It sounds like your group needs to embrace and institutionalize a mentoring program. At my company, mentoring has always been done informally and worked best for the hungriest proteges and willing/knowledgeable mentors. We have formalized that such that mentors and proteges are matched based upon technical need, interests, personal development, or general career mentorship (survival of an engineer in the corporate/government environment... or what the heck do I really want to do and how do I get there???).

It takes a few champions to head it up, but it will pay off well in the end. The effort depends on the size of your company. We started with just my department and then one of the corporate Veeps liked it and ported it out to the enterprise.

Additionally, leaders and managers, should put time into documentation and processes. This will help standardize what people know and create a baseline/foundation for the junior folks before taking up mentor time. Hopefully those will be documents that are kept fresh from time to time or you run the risk of tunnel vision (that's the way we've always done it syndrome).

And oh, btw, there's no reason a junior person can't mentor a senior person on some new tech or methods they learned somewhere else.

So, the key is to make mentoring, whether formal or informal, part of the culture.

As a protege I have experienced the value and return of a good mentoring program. As a mentor, I have taken a lot of satisfaction seeing my proteges make rapid progress up the technical ladder. As a manager, I understand the value and efficencies a mentoring program brings to the bottom line as well as the loyalty it develops in the junior engineers. It is one big reason I have almost no attrition due to quits... my biggest problem is that we train our folks so well they get promoted to positions out of my group.

Best of luck.

 

[debodine]

myhonda:

Gave you a star for that post. You are the kind of leader any company should be glad to have. All leaders understand that it is a hassle when you do your mentoring so well that people get promoted out of your group, but in my opinion that is exactly what should be the result of a good mentoring program.

The golden rule encourages people to treat others how they wish to be treated themselves, and it works very well here. I have always appreciated mentors who taught me how to succeed not only in my current tasks, but in being ready for opportunities as well. Like you, I enjoy providing those opportunites for the people I have the responsibility and the privilege to mentor.

Keep up the great mentoring program, your company is the better for your efforts, I believe.

debodine

 

[jenn454]

I would think that the best resource for the topic would be the novice engineers themselves. Ask the novice engineers what information do they feel would be most beneficial when given a new project. What information are managers failing to relay to them? What areas do they struggle in and feel a manager’s guidance could be beneficial.

At the same time ask the positive. What things did the manager do that were beneficial? Did your manager give you useful information? If so what was it?

As a novice engineer myself I could easily answer these questions to identify the areas were I could have used more guidance from my managers. I could also point out times where the information they gave me was sufficient and I was able to do an excellent job on the project.

 

[Ashereng]

Here are some additional thoughts.

"I would think that the best resource for the topic would be the novice engineers themselves. Ask the novice engineers what information do they feel would be most beneficial when given a new project."

I feel that since mentoring is a two way street, there is also some onus on the novice and those wishing mentorship to speak up and seek it.

If one needs something, and doesn't tell anyone, there is a good chance that they wouldn't get it since nobody is aware that they need/want it.

Some "senior" people may feel it "presumptuous" to ask a junior/novice if they want mentoring.


"The golden rule encourages people to treat others how they wish to be treated themselves, and it works very well here."

I have never really understood this "golden rule". I feel that there is a HUGE probability that some people may not want to be treated the way I would.

For example. One person may appreciate it when someone offers to help when they see them struggling. Another person may take offence since they see it as a slight that someone perceives that they can't do something.

I try to follow an alternative rule: "Treat others the way THEY want to be treated."

 

[debodine]

Ashereng:

You have an interesting perspective on the golden rule, and I think you have a very good alternative rule. If a mentor/potential mentor knows how a person wishes to be treated in specific situations, then within reason they should treat them that way.

In fact, I often ask a person directly how they want to be treated in specific situations, and if I can reasonably do so, that's what I do. Of course, if I don't know for sure, I do fall back on the golden rule and it works.

In addition to my responsibility to train and mentor, I also have a competing responsibility to oversee company projects and maintain schedule, cost and quality. So there have occasionally been times when I would become more directive and less mentoring in my approach. However, in general I think your alternative rule would work well.

debodine

 

[HVAC68]

When I started off as a "novice" engineer, I didn't have the luxury of training - rather, was straight "handling" a project - they called it "on the job training".

Made lot of mistakes, learnt a lot of lessons, still continue to - what was and is important is to ensure that

(a) you don't repeat the same mistakes.
(b) the mistakes are not too costly - so, you need to make an assessment of how much you can go wrong and ask questions at the right time to the right person - now, this is tricky and is very subjective.
(c) you ask a lot of questions to experienced people, especially, who may or may not be academically qualified, but have learnt things the hard way and are willing to share their knowledge. Lot of people management skills and personal relationship is important.
(d) you have a never-say-die spirit. Keep your eyes and ears open and be observant

Good luck



HVAC68