TRIZ (Theory of Inventive Problem Solving) 1

[NGiLuzzu]

Dear All,
it recently happened to me to come across the general definition of "TRIZ" (acronym from Russian "Teoriya Resheniya Izobretatelskikh Zadatch" = Theory of Inventive Problem Solving)...

See, for reference:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Triz

Does anybody know and/or apply this methodology?

Any suggestion to get introduced into the subject? Any good books "for Dummies"?

Thanks and Regards, 'NGL

 

[MikeHalloran]

A _method_ for inventing?

"Buy this package, and you can lay off those expensive engineers, and replace them with corporate drones."?

I'm surprised the road show hasn't come to town already.




Mike Halloran
Pembroke Pines, FL, USA

 

[Latexman]

The 6[σ] Master Black Belts at my company are trained in it and I've been involved in TRIZ sessions to develop new technology. It worked!

Good luck,
Latexman

 

[IRstuff]

TRIZ is pretty darn old. We took a course on it over 15 years ago.

The links in the Wikipedia article are pretty much the panoply of commercial TRIZ proponents, although there might be one or two training companies that aren't listed

TTFN

Eng-Tips Policies FAQ731-376

 

[tgrimley]

I know this text

http://www.amazon.com/Product-Design-Kevin-Otto/dp/0130212717

discusses TIPS/TRIZ in detail with a few examples. Also check out papers by Dr Wood, Otto, or Antonsson as they have done some work with this.

 

[dwt]

"And Suddenly the Inventor Appeared: TRIZ, the Theory of Inventive Problem Solving" by Genrich Altshuller

I have only skimmed it so far, but it has some interesting examples.
Altshuller is considered one of the creators of TRIZ.

 

[GregLocock]

It may be of some use to some people. I won that Altshuller book as a door prize at a TRIZ sales pitch (sorry, lecture). I could only stand two chapters of it.

There again I'm a lousy inventor.

Cheers

Greg Locock

Please see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips.

 

[KENAT]

Hmm, I see how this is going.

Link the TRIZ software to a CAD Package, link the CAD Package to an FEA Package, CFD package, and then link that to a CAM package. Presumably all through a PDM/PLM system.

Hey presto you can fire, sorry I mean down size or 're-structure' your entire engineering department.

I'd still be interested to find out more but I looked at the wiki article and am skeptical.

 

[IRstuff]

TRIZ, by itself, does nothing toward designing or inventing. TRIZ simply collected and organized all the possible generic avenues for an inventor to explore. The idea of TRIZ is to ensure that an inventor doesn't miss a potential avenue for a solution.

TTFN

Eng-Tips Policies FAQ731-376

 

[cbrn]

Hi,
is it something like "TRIZ = common sense"?

I looked at the wiki article also, and I too am skeptical...

Theoretics of these kinds will one day teach us how to breathe (oops, pardon, ensure that we don't miss an opportunity to inspire air)

Regards

 

[25362]

For a very interesting and practical book I suggest David Saletan's Creative troubleshooting in the chemical process industries Chapman and Hall.

 

[RPstress]

It certainly looks as if a fair few people make a living off of selling and promoting TRIZ.

The Wikipedia article says that "The effectiveness of TRIZ is in dispute in many Engineering circles. For example, no innovative new product can be furnished which owes its creation to the TRIZ methodology. TRIZ products most often are existing products which have been improved marginally."

On the other hand Latexman above says "It worked!"

Latexman: what did it work on and what was produced?

 

[tkordyban]

A short course on TRIZ is offered by ASME (American Society of Mechancial Engineers). You can find a description on the society web site.

 

[Denial]

One of the classic books in this area is "The Psychology of Invention in the Mathematical Field", written by Jacques Hadamard of Princeton University in the mid 1940s, and published by the Princeton University Press. It concentrates upon creativity at the highest possible level, in an individual rather than a group context, and examines the roles of the conscious and the subconscious in solving a problem.

Among many other things, Hadamard lists the phases through which mathematical creativity often passes.
Preparation. This is when the subconscious is "primed" for the problem. It is usually intense (perhaps the more so the better), and often protracted.
Incubation. This is when the subconscious actually does its thing: cross-linking ideas, synthesising, sifting, sieving, etc. It is generally assisted by a state of relaxation (sometimes only physical, sometimes only mental, sometimes both).
Illumination. This is when the subconscious "delivers the goods". It happens suddenly, and the answer tends to be complete rather than partial. Illumination is sometimes preceded by another phase that Hadamard calls Intimation.
Verification. Self explanatory. This phase is necessary because the process is not infallible.

Hadamard does not claim that these are ever sufficient, and he does not claim that they are always necessary. But he does claim that at the very least they appear to be conducive to creativity.

A couple of years ago I saw a newspaper article quoting Nobel laureate James Watson (of DNA fame) as having said, "It is necessary to be slightly underemployed if you are to do something significant." This is totally consistent with Hadamard's comments on the incubation phase.

And totally at odds with most modern corporate cultures, with or without any consultant-driven acronymic fad.

 

[IRstuff]

It's hard to prove a negative.

Having had TRIZ training, can you obviously say that anything you had done afterwards wasn't impacted by your training, particularly since TRIZ attempts to help you bookkeep different alternatives to the solution space?

At the minimum, TRIZ should allow you to organize your solution space efforts and help you ensure that potential solutions are not missed.

TTFN

Eng-Tips Policies FAQ731-376

 

[dcasto]

Look at the time period this was "invented", all puns intented, the soviets were in a world of hurt, no infastructure, nada, nothing, every department was responsible for meeting goals and those that didn't were beatem down. If agriculture didn't produce enough, they were were disrewarded and if factories produced enough tractors, they were rewarded. So, noone would share success because that other department might do better. The idea of using technology in one area to another is the capitalist way.

I can't tell you how many times I've done this. My latest was taken from another poster about using an automobile refrigeration compressor to compress natural gas, how cool. I just saw where a company is modifying the old auto AC to use CO2 as a refrigerant AT 1600 psig!! CO2 at 1600 psig is as deadly as nat gas at 20 psig, IMHO. Look TRIZ without a class, book, or fancy acronymn, It's common sence (as present by posters here) for engineers.