Using my PE stamp to review others' drawings? 1

[subsearobot]

Hi. I have been referred by a previous employer to review and stamp drawings for a small art installation (it's a collaboration). It will be installed in a public park which requires PE stamping for all installations within. I hold a mechanical PE in California, where the installation will be erected. My understanding (I have not talked to the "client" yet- I am trying to go in educated on PE practices) is that it is a simple installation. Likely to be a small frame for supporting a sculpture. I have designed this sort of thing in the past, and am very familiar with the design requirements of this type of work (aside from the PE stamping- that is new to me).

Assuming a simple project that is within my expertise (as it was suggested to me), is it legal for me to stamp said drawings (assuming I review the design to my satisfaction, reserve rights to redline etc?) I've been googling, and I am not getting a definitive answer. I do not want to skirt the law. It seems like there must be a provision to do this somehow?

Again, not looking to "rubber stamp" it to make some money, looking to legally stamp it, both as an intro to consulting for me, and a favor to a small art house.

thanks in advance!

 

[Lomarandil]

Not an answer to your legal/ethical question (I think that falls on the definition of "Responsible Charge", which isn't usually straightforward in cases like this)...

But would a stamped letter meet the requirements of the park owner?

 

[subsearobot]

My understanding is that it is either a federal or state park, with bureaucratic requirements, and accompanying lack of flexibility.

 

[thaidavid40]

The practice in Alabama has been that if you do a FULL review of the design - as if you had been the primary designer in the first place - then you can accept responsibility as the "designer of record". This places you in "responsible charge" of the final documents. At that point, the original designer becomes nothing more than a junior designer who has submitted their design to you for review and approval, prior to release. Of course, all of this is predicated upon your reviewing a design within your area of qualified expertise.

Thaidavid

 

[Ron]

subsearobot....if you want to assume the responsibility for someone else's design, you must review their design in sufficient detail to accept it as your own. That's a typical engineering law requirement. Check with your state on that one.

Are you capable of designing such a system? If you designed it without input from others, would the design on the table be something you would do without question? Are you able to make any changes to the design that you deem necessary for engineering efficacy? If you can't answer yes, truthfully, to each of the these, then the answer is "NO". Don't sign and seal the design. If you can answer yes to all and you do the review, then there should be no issue.

 

[subsearobot]

Ron, I agree with what you are saying. I would certainly not sign something outside of my expertise. But "legally" speaking, if I did this, suppose an accident happened, a lawsuit ensued. Would my liability insurance deny me coverage because the design was not actually made under my direct charge (that is how the regulations seem to read, but I would expect flexibility in said regs. What if a PE gets hit by a bus mid project? Does that project need to be scrapped so another PE can take over??)

 

[JedClampett]

You should call your liability carrier for your coverage.
As far as the hitting by bus scenario, I suppose that his business successors take the liability. If it's not a business, his heirs are on the hook. But if you had insurance, they would cover it.
But getting legal advice on an Engineering website is like getting pump sizing advice from the Bar Association.

 

[JAE]

I think Ron's concept where you fully review, and have the ability to make changes to the design, would place you in the same position, liability-wise, and insurance-wise, as though you did the original design itself.

The former engineer is out of the picture, not the engineer-of-record, and you are taking their place.

Check out Eng-Tips Forum's Policies here:
faq731-376

 

[Ron]

JAE is correct. The design is now "yours" and you bear the responsibility for it.

 

[BUGGAR]

If you take it on, please send us some photos of the artwork you will be "supporting". I think you will need to use the CBC "A" chapters for this since there is public involved. If they're big pieces, what seismic coefficients will be used? The seismic requirements for hospitals would be easiest (?) to follow.

 

[subsearobot]

Thanks for your thoughts all.
I was hoping for a definitive reply, such as, "yes, I've done this, you simply need to have it in writing that you have taken on ownership of the project, signed by the original designer."

I'll be calling the insurance guys in the morning. I am in no way interested in tarnishing my professional reputation by skirting regulations.

I have a few more details: it's not a building, it's a simple underwater sculpture garden. But I do not as yet know of regulations that need to be adhered to for this installation. There are moorings and such to consider, but that is within my field of expertise.

It's murkey, at best. But I'd like the experience, and I'd like to help an artist install his project. So I will follow this a bit further, and see if it pans out.

 

[BUGGAR]

"There are moorings and such to consider"
Now you really have my curiosity. This is for divers? Any chance you can spill some details on what they are planning?

 

[dbill74]

You should also review the laws and rules of the state you are registered in. Here in Florida at least, if you sign another's work you are taking responsibility for that work be it good or bad. I assume the issue of responsibility is similar in other states. So the question becomes how much risk are you and your insurance willing to take.

Personally, if I'm not somehow directly involved with the design providing input, I would be hesitant to sign and seal it.

 

[subsearobot]

Buggar, It's indeed for divers- it's an underwater sculpture garden. So it needs to be robust, as people will be swimming/diving in close proximity. Not sure how much more I can share as of yet...

dbill, I've taken manned submersibles (small, 1 to 10 person "submarines") through the ABS certification procedure to assure compliance with regulations. These vehicles were designed and built (80% built in one case) by other companies. Once it is ABS certified, it is suitable to be insured. This process involves thorough review of all life support calcs, lifting arrangement, hull structure etc. It also involved creating calculations to check as-built systems, creating new designs as necessary, and validation testing. This was not under the PE licence, but as far as I know, it's as stringent- it's life support for human occupation.

I only hope PE stamping allows the same flexibility. Will check with local regulators and insurance agency.

cheers