What does it mean when an architect asks me to provide a quote to do "Civil Engineering". 2

[randymel]

This is for a new health center in an open field. We've done land surveying for this architect before. He is asking for a topographic survey (no problem), but also "civil engineering". He has already told me that another firm is doing the geotechnical engineering (which probably means that foundation and pavement design will be included with the geotech report). I'm guessing this engineer wants me to provide earthwork design? Anything else? Utilities, etc? Also, this site is a "superfund" (Non-active) site.

Thanks.

 

[msquared48]

Ask him for specifics.

This could include utilities, earthwork, road design, as well as storm drainage design to include any storm water detention facilities. It could also include shoring...

ASK!

Mike McCann, PE, SE (WA)

 

[JAE]

...parking, site lighting, small retaining walls, curb & gutter....

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[msquared48]

Does he want you to do the permitting too?

Mike McCann, PE, SE (WA)

 

[msquared48]

And, technically speaking, Surveying, Geotechnical, as well as Structural are all elements of "Civil Engineering".

Again, get specifics.



Mike McCann, PE, SE (WA)

 

[allgoodnamestaken]

How are we going to know an architect's intended scope of work for your firm? Just talk to him and clarify what is included in the scope of work.

 

[Retrograde]

For me it would be the following and would include all approvals with the local authorities:

Erosion and sediment control
Bulk earthworks
Roadworks (including intersections, signage and linemarking)
Pavements (hardstand)
Stormwater drainage
Water reticulation
Sewerage reticulation
Retaining walls

 

[Ron]

No! No! No!.....I have not done a lot of "civil engineering" in the past 15 years, but have done a fair amount before that. My proposals (and fee estimates) stop at submittal to the AHJ (Authority Having Jurisdiction). You NEVER know what they will ask you to do beyond your initial submittal.

Yes, you have an obligation to make that submittal as comprehensive as practicable; however, you cannot read their minds and cannot suppose what they will require in the next submittal....so, make sure that anything after the initial submittal is done on an hourly rate so that you don't lose a ton of money.

The same goes for any submittal to a public agency; whether for civil, structural or other.

 

[msquared48]

Good point Ron.

I forgot that local jurisdictions have a propensity to change the rules in the middle of the game, and contract, especially in environmental matters!

Thanks.

Mike McCann, PE, SE (WA)

 

[Retrograde]

Yes! Yes! Yes!.....I know local practice varies from place to place, but in my neck of the woods if you qualified your proposal like that you would win exactly ZERO work.

 

[Ron]

Retrograde....sometimes the better win is not getting the job!

 

[BUGGAR]

"Superfund site"

 

[Ingenuity]

I think Retrograde and Ron are both correct, even though they are "thousands of miles (kilometres) away" in scope.

Literally, with Ron in the USA and Retograde in AU, the two areas are distinctly different in how they practice locally.

With structural steel, for example, in AU (back when I was practicing in Sydney), all connections were detailed by the EoR. In the USA, the shear and moment is given by the EoR for the steel detailer and his PE to design/detail.

No method is more right, or more wrong, just different.

 

[Retrograde]

Retrograde....sometimes the better win is not getting the job!

I would certainly agree with that!