What the heck is Systems Engineeing?

[TheMasterMechanic]

In my quest for grad schools, I have come across a few schools that offer a masters in systems engineering. I had never heard of it and figured it was a money making scheme and ignored it. Recently, however, I got my monthly issue of money magazine which had an article about the best job growth and Numero Uno on the list was systems engineer. They described it as dealing with the project managment aspect of engineering. Wikipedia has a nice article about it and also. My question is this: Does anyone have a Masters degree in Systems Engineeing? If so, what are your opinions of it? What did you learn? Would you do it again?

Thanks Guys/Gals!

 

[Hydromechdude]

I'm a systems engineer for an aircraft company. My job function is to ensure the safety of the system, compliance to regulations, designing/integrating the individual system components to make the complete system, correcting/dealing with any problems that arise due to quality escapes, new regulations, premature failures, etc.

As someone mentioned earlier in this thread, a poor system design may not become apparent until years after the product has been delivered.

 

[HgTX]

At IBM in the 1980s and 1990s, a Systems Engineer was a salesperson (of large integrated computer systems, not household PCs) with some kind of engineering degree.

Hg

Eng-Tips policies: faq731-376

 

[plasgears]

In project engineering, a Gantt chart shows how several developments progress together instead of in tandem. It is a time saver. Think of engine development running parallel with structure, control and other system details.

 

[BigInch]

So then ... what's a system's administrator?
Windows says I should see one every so often. From the number of times it says that, I should think you would be able to find one on any street corner, but they don't seem to hang around there. Perhaps a systems engineer might be able to substitute for a system's administrator, since I always figured that a systems engineer was the one that actually did the real work and the administrator was his boss, who really wasn't supposed to do anything except administrate the systems engineers anyway.

**********************
"Pumping accounts for 20% of the world’s energy used by electric motors and 25-50% of the total electrical energy usage in certain industrial facilities."-DOE statistic (Note: Make that 99% for pipeline companies)

http://virtualpipeline.spaces.live.com/

 

[GregLocock]

Shrugs, project scheduling and project management are separate activities related to the discipline known as Systems Engineering, which... well hell if you don't know what it is look at wikipedia.

Cheers

Greg Locock

SIGlease see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips.

 

[rwingace]

The company I currently work for has a Systems Engineering department in which their function is to be the lead engineer overseeing all the functional engineering departments.

They are mostly the go between the technical people and the program management as well as customer discussions.

There is no formal education needed at my company other than an Engineering degree in a related field and an overall knowledge of the product.

 

[BigInch]

Project management department would fulfill that function in EPC houses.

**********************
"Pumping accounts for 20% of the world’s energy used by electric motors and 25-50% of the total electrical energy usage in certain industrial facilities."-DOE statistic (Note: Make that 99% for pipeline companies)

http://virtualpipeline.spaces.live.com/

 

[demayeng]

I have a degree in Systems Engineering - it's a blend of mechanical, electrical and control systems.

Best way to describe it is with the example of a car as a system. It has mechanical components integrated with sensors, electrical components and control software.

I did subjects ranging from stress analysis and materials to semiconductors and advanced signal processing.

My last job was with hybrid vehicles where the degree made a lot of sense.

 

[moltenmetal]

Hmm, and my uni now offers a "mechatronics" engineering program (i.e. your blend of mech, elec and controls) as well as the pre-existing systems design engineering program (aforementioned welcome source of girls to the eng department).

No "industrial engineering" program, though. Guess that's a dirty word these days.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Industrial_engineering

They also offer a nanotechnology engineering program- hybrid of chem eng and physics (whose students find great difficulty in obtaining co-op work term jobs).

"Buzzword engineering" apparently attracts government grant money, so it's doing its job as far as the uni is concerned.

 

[mauricestoker]

Systems engineering also includes human and redundant factors, sometimes simultaneously, as with advanced research at the Department of Redundancy Department. Coming up with wholly redundant buzz words can be difficult and not easy to do.

 

[ShaggyPE]

here is a link from a systems engineering consulting site.

http://www.optants.com/tutor/ceseipt.htm#SEMTH

-Dustin
Professional Engineer
Certified SolidWorks Professional
Certified COSMOSWorks Designer Specialist
Certified SolidWorks Advanced Sheet Metal Specialist

 

[HamishMcTavish]

There seems to be a few negative opinions of systems engineering out there! It is more than a 'new' method of project management. From what i can see it is best applied up front in the project definition phase. For instance making sure that the requirements are adequately captured and defined in a way that can be developed. Ok, maybe it's not doing 'hard sums' but it is INCREDIBLY important for success. I've had the unfortunate privelege to work on several large projects that could have benefited from this approach...

Perhaps some should try to identify WHY this discipline has come about? INCOSE (which someone posted the link to earlier) is trying to establish the competency framework so that those in the US can go down the PE route. The original methodology seems to have come out of software / electronic / user-interface type problems but is equally applicable to other engineering projects. Needless to say this is not a job someone with no engineering knowledge can do well.

Seems to be more use in big projects where system complexity and integration can be a real issue, otherwise it might be a big hammer for a small nut.

NASA use it...

http://nodis3.gsfc.nasa.gov/displayDir.cfm?t=NPR&c=7123&s=1A

DoD use it

http://www.dod.mil/ddre/org_sys_eng.html

DOE use it

http://cio.energy.gov/SEM3_1231.pdf

Ok, maybe that isn't a ringing endorsement for it but nonetheless it doesn't surprise me that that type of role is getting offered big bucks (going back to the OP)- too many projects run over time and budget.

Regards all, HM

No more things should be presumed to exist than are absolutely necessary - William of Occam

 

[moltenmetal]

I wouldn't characterize my opinion of the subdiscipline as negative. Rather, I would say that the sub-discipline is ill-defined, and there are several other disciplines with similar attributes and descriptions. That explains the confusion about what a systems design engineer actually does.

Sounds like systems should be a masters program done after you complete a bachelors in one of the traditional non-military disciplines (those are civil, mech, chem and electrical in my books).

 

[PEinc]

Systems Engineer sounds like a mechanical/electrical/software ARCHITECT - but without the bow tie!

http://www.PeirceEngineering.com

 

[silverbullet1986]

A masters appears typically necessary because no one gets a bachelors in systems... doesn't exist.

There are BS degrees in Systems Engineering.

http://seor.gmu.edu/

George Mason University offers it as a BS and is supposedly a great program. Im sure the location of the school has most to do with that (30 mins away from DC).

 

[FeX32]

That program doesn't look hardcore at all.


Fe

 

[mauricestoker]

GW runs a lot of programs specifically catering to the gubmint. I was offered to teach task order contracting for fixed firm price plus incentive contracts there, but it sounded as exciting as the systems engineering class. From what I have seen, that is a good thing for the gubmint and GW.

When you look at the cost overruns on major procurements in the government, it's easy to see how systems engineering would be applicable, and might even avoid buying $700 hammers and synthetic urine for testing on-board aircraft heads. I remember reviewing the AF synthetic urine program and commenting that I could provide the real thing for a tenth of the price and only specialty tool I would need would be a bottle opener. Of course, it was still funded.