Y/? start elecitrcal motor wiring

[WvPetegem]

Dear all,

I hope you can help me out with following question related to the wiring of a 3-phase electrical motor with a Y/Δ starter.
Originally I have a ABB motor (M2AA type) which is when switched in delta:

V2 switched to U1 (via phase L1)
W2 switched to V1 (via phase L2)
U2 switched to W1 (via phase L3)

Now, the electrical motor is damaged (one winding completely burned) and I bought a new WEG motor (type W22 IE3).
The connection diagram from the manufacturer prescribes that the delta-connection should be:

V4 switched to W1
W4 switched to U1
U4 switched to V1

(Maybe relevant; the same connection diagram states that in delta, the other terminals should be connected as: U2-U3, V2-V3, W2-W3.
The original ABB motor did not have this Dahlander-connection possibility).

Which connection diagram should I follow? The diagram as the manufacturer prescribes, or the original diagram as how the original motor as connected?
What is the effect/difference between those two different connection schemes? Or is this defined in the construction of the electric motor itself?

For reference, I added the original connection diagram (it is the motor on the right-hand side. And I added the connection diagram as I received with the new motor.

Thanks a lot in advance for any helpful answer!
I am stuck at the moment with an A/C installation which cannot run because the AC fan motor (the motor described above) is finished.

 

[WvPetegem]

It only allowed me to upload one file with the post.
Hereby the other document (the original diagram).

 

[ScottyUK]

You mentioned a Dahlander motor - does this motor have two running speeds listed on the maker's plate, or is it a dual-winding machine capable of operation on a wide range of voltages (V[sub]n[/sub], 1.73V[sub]n[/sub], 2V[sub]n[/sub], 3.46V[sub]n[/sub])? If it's the latter case then you need to connect the windings so that the winding voltage matches that of your old motor, but you haven't supplied sufficient information about the new motor for us to help with that.

 

[petronila]

Hi Wv Petegem

You have a 12 leads motor (no a motor for european or US marked, )seems the motor leads are labelled for Brazil marked.

Windings of 12 leads motors can be connected for dual voltage i.e. 230/460 volts the low voltage connection is in parallel (230 V) and the high voltage connection is serial (460 V).

Your actual motor is marked with numbers and letters if your motor is 460 V or 380 V, the connection that you need (In new motor connection diagram provided by you) is the third form left to right.

Using this connection you will have 6 leads available, V1, V4, W1, W4 and U1, U4, like you can see in your AC fan motor original diagram, your original motor leads are marked like U1,U2, V1,V2, W1,W2. Then for connection matters, the labels V4, W4 and U4 are equivalent to old labels V2, W2 and U2.

An idea to avoid issues is mark with paper tape the new motor leads V4 like V2, W4 like W2 and U4 like U2 then you can connect the new motor according with your Ac fan motor original diagram.

The problem that you can find is reverse rotation, if you have it, switch two of power leads that feeds the contactor 110 Q6.


Best Regards

Carlos

 

[WvPetegem]

Hi Carlos,
You're right, the replacement motor comes from the Brazillian market.
So if I understand you right, if I connect the lead U4-W4 as per original drawing, there is no chance that this harms the motor (e.g. starting CW in star, en then turning CCW in delta)?
It may only affect the rotation direction? (In that case, indeed, only swapping 2 phases (e.g. L1-L2) would solve that issue.

Regarding the types of motors. Could you all please help me also out with this?

The original motor is a ABB M2AA 11kW motor (3GAA162111-ADA). Specs can be found here:

http://www.abb.com/productdetails/ABB3GAA162111-ADA

The new motor is a WEG W22 IR3 20HP (15kW) motor. Specs can be found attached to this post.

There are some differences in specifications. Could you please check if this would be an electrical issue?
The breaker we have can handle 325A inrush current. I believe that the new motor is still under that.
The motor is driving a fan (with 50Hz and 4 poles this would be the same speed), so there is no extra power take-off from the motor (no more load that original).
My concern is this:
The new motor spec has voltage: 220/380/440 V. This while our system is 400V. Is this a problem?
The new motor spec shows 60Hz. While our system is 50Hz. I believe this only affects the speed?


On the last page of the attached document is the full connection diagram of the motor (including delta-delta and star-star).


Thanks again!

 

[petronila]

Hi WvPetergem

I was take a look of the data sheets and I don´t see any electrical Issue, the breker will support Inrush Current. the motor will drawn 29.2 Full load Amperes at 400 V-50 Hz and the Is/In = 6.2 so the Inrsh current will be about 182 amps.

You can connect the motor like I told you. First run the motor with no load and verify is drawning the right no load amperes (about 10 or 12 amperes).

The motor could run at 400 v-50 Hz and will ran at 1460 rpm (approach) so no problem with the motor power. Like you said The 50 hz only will affect the speed.

Best regards

Carlos

 

[WvPetegem]

Hi Carlos,

Thanks a lot!

What would be the effect when I wire the E-motor as per manufacturer diagram (compared to the original diagram)?

 

[petronila]

Hi WvPetegem

The replacement motor (WEG) would works. I don´t see any issue.

Like I told you, you most connect the new motor with the third diagram from left to right like is showed in the WEG´s information. Just note that in new motor you have three of the six leads labeled like U4, V4 and W4 this three leads are equivalents to original leads of ABB motor U2, V2 and W2.
Relabed with paper tape the new motor leads U4, V4 and W4 like this way: U4= U2, V4= V2 and W4= W2. Once you did this you will have three leads of the new motor labeled like U1, V1 and W1 and another three relabeled like U2, V2, W2.

To end, connect the new motor to the contactors in the same way like original ABB motor and runned in no load, verify rotation and no-load current (will be about 10 to 12 A). To reverse rotation follow earlier instructions.

Regards

Carlos

 

[waross]

I agree with Carlos for your connections, BUT:
You may have a bigger problem than connections.
The Volts per Hertz ratio.
440 Volts at 60 Hertz gives a v/Hz ratio of 7.33 Volts per Hertz.
A V/Hz ratio of 7.33 at 50 Hz gives a voltage of 367 Volts.
Your motor will be unhappy with a voltage much more than 367 Volts at 50 Hz.
367 times 110% is 403 Volts. The motor may work at 400 Volts, 50 Hertz, but any voltage rise on your supply may drive the motor into magnetic saturation and possible rapid burnout. At the least an over load trip.

Bill
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"Why not the best?"
Jimmy Carter