Yay, Masonry Veneer House

[XR250]

I don't do a lot of these any more as siding seems to be in-vogue around here. This house has 3 5/8" limestone veneer (44 PSF). How do y'all handle the situations where the lower roofs abut the 2-story portion? My goto has been to carry the veneer on angle bearing on a triple rafter (per the IRC) but I go further and add a pony wall under the rafter that transfers down to a stout beam or to the foundation elements. I then specify vertical control joints in the masonry where it transitions from wood to masonry support.

The Arch. wants the masonry to go all the way thru with weeps and flashing above the roof lines (I don't know why). I am trying to honor that. Construction sequencing and cost are apparently not issues on this project so no need to consider that.

What ever solution has to provide:
1) Vertical support of the masonry
2) Lateral shear of the lower roof
3) Longitudinal forces in the lower roof
4) Forces from the cantilevered diaphragms at the porches.

I am not a fan of lagging an angle into the gable end studs or to blocking between the studs as this is never done acceptably in my experience.

 

[TheDW]

We've been using a variation of the lag screw into blocking detail. We double up the studs and 'let-in' notch a continuous 2x8 to lag the angle to. I've not heard any complaints but my suspicion is that the 'let in' part gets missed or ignored. I'd be interested to see if there are better/easier options out there as well

 

[masonrygeek]

Maybe I'm misunderstanding, but a brick veneer wall shouldn't be loadbearing. It can transfer wind loads to the backing, but it shouldn't be a part of the roof support system. Can you transition to a loadbearing block wall beneath the limestone veneer that runs to a support on the foundation? Or can you bring the veneer wall down to a steel angle or beam that is horizontal that is then supported by steel columns (your "pony wall detail)? While the flashing will break bond, I'm not sure that has an impact on the veneer support. I don't know if it would help, but BIA Tech Note 28 on brick veneer/wood studs discusses brick support: https://www.gobrick.com/media/file/28-brick-veneer-wood-stud-walls.pdf.

 

[phamENG]

Interesting. It's like they want to make it look like it's an addition...

1) Vertical support of the masonry
If you carry it to the foundation, that's easy. Done.
2) Lateral shear of the lower roof
For additions to veneer buildings, I've specified brackets that get attached to the structural wall behind at some spacing, and then attach a ledger to it. Contractors hate it because they have to remove brick around them, but if they are installed from the start it wouldn't be too bad. It can be a pair of steel plates with a piece of HSS between them. Bolt it to the wall, and then bolt the ledger to it. There are companies that produce similar products for deck ledgers (not the Simpson product you love soooo much...). Here's one that uses a wide flange - neat idea... DeckStruc
3) Longitudinal forces in the lower roof
Worst case, you can use tension ties?
4) Forces from the cantilevered diaphragms at the porches.
If you go with the brackets, make sure it's designed so your chords align with a bracket (maybe a beefed up bracket?) that can handle the reaction.

 

[XR250]

Interesting. It's like they want to make it look like it's an addition...

1) Vertical support of the masonry
If you carry it to the foundation, that's easy. Done.
2) Lateral shear of the lower roof
For additions to veneer buildings, I've specified brackets that get attached to the structural wall behind at some spacing, and then attach a ledger to it. Contractors hate it because they have to remove brick around them, but if they are installed from the start it wouldn't be too bad. It can be a pair of steel plates with a piece of HSS between them. Bolt it to the wall, and then bolt the ledger to it. There are companies that produce similar products for deck ledgers (not the Simpson product you love soooo much...). Here's one that uses a wide flange - neat idea... DeckStruc
3) Longitudinal forces in the lower roof
Worst case, you can use tension ties?
4) Forces from the cantilevered diaphragms at the porches.
If you go with the brackets, make sure it's designed so your chords align with a bracket (maybe a beefed up bracket?) that can handle the reaction.

Yup, thought about using these or something similar.... Probably easier to get something fabbed up locally though.

Deck Bracket - Maine Deck Bracket

Maine Deck Brackets are Rugged Aluminum Extrusions, specifically designed for proper attachment of stairs, Decks, signs, porches, or any other appendage to buildings or other structural uses; MAINE Deck Brackets allow attachments without creating openings or pockets for water, debris, or insects...

deckbracket.com

Thanks for the advice.