eng-tips promoting laziness? 6

Eng-Tips (the site) is not promoting laziness, but its members who offer detailed answers to a posters question are.

There's nothing wrong with giving an answer, but the source (a book, the Help files, etc) should also be referenced. A partial answer with a linked to the source for the remainder is best.

Lazy, nope. I think most users of this site are genuinely interested in the answers they get rather than just needing them ASAP.

Those who need something "urgently" but clearly haven't invested any of their own time either get RF'd or the usual suspects wade in and we all have a snigger at their expense.

- Steve

Is it lazy to ask a question of a co-worker with more experience? Basically the same thing happens here.

As Sompting said, most of the people who are "lazy" and don't want to research get RF'd.

I think this site is extremely valuable, especially for younger engineers who have questions that may not be in textbooks, and are looking for answers based on experience.

V

I don't feel like responding...I ditto the others.

Chris
SolidWorks/PDMWorks 08 3.1
AutoCAD 08
ctopher's home (updated Aug 5, 2008)
ctopher's blog
SolidWorks Legion

I can't even be bothered forming an opinion. I'll just use those given above...

I think that the 'immediate gratification' is a symptom of the modern world. The digital revolution has placed unheard of volumes of data at the click of a button. Whether that makes someone lazy depends on how you use it.

There are definately lazy posters who couldn't even be bothered spending the 10 seconds required to use a search engine. They are the exception.

I think most people (fresh grad through to seasoned pro) are here to learn. The fact that they made the effort to post questions and reply to others indicates most posters are not lazy.

vc66,
I don't agree that this site is most valuable for younger engineers. I get a lot of value from it and it's been decades since anyone called me "younger" (in fact my kids claim I'm older than dirt). Even some of the incredibly basic questions that start a discussion can teach us tottering old folks a thing or two as the conversation develops.

Many of us "usual suspects" will look at the posting history of the OP of a new question and if they are just asking and never helping, we either pick at them or ignore them. Some realize that to get answers they have to give them and become useful. The others just get frustrated with the lack of help they get and go away. Both answers are just fine.

What I love about this place is the peer review. When I say something stupid here (a couple of times a day), a half dozen folks chime in pretty quickly with corrections, alternative analysis, or ridicule--all help.

I've rarely seen anyone with the cheek to cite eng-tips.com as the basis for a real world decision. If someone comes here and gets the answer to how to compute the moment of inertia of a sphere, they'll never admit it inside their company. Maybe next time they'll be able to tell someone else how to compute the volume of an earthen berm for a SPCC plan (another very basic question, but one that requires a clear statement of your assumptions).

David

I am pretty green but I get a lot from this site. A lot of it is beyond my experience level but without seeing people talk about what kind of problems they have, I would have no idea what I should be trying to get better at or what the industry bibles are.

I think the number of people here that ask a question to get free or easy answers are far and few between. On sites like PLCTALK.net, it is a running joke on how every quarter a bunch of students will ask a question about how to make a stoplight with a plc. This site is nothing like that.

I've rarely seen anyone with the cheek to cite eng-tips.com as the basis for a real world decision.

Click to expand...

Maybe not.

But I am fearful that eng-tips is used - uncited - far too often as the basis for real-world decisions.

I started reading Eng-Tips about 1 year ago. I have asked a couple of questions, and I have offered a few answers (If I felt like I had them.) Mostly I just enjoy reading about the challenges in other industries and learning I few things I would probably never see in my work. A good example of this is AC motors and VFDs. I would never use them in my line of work, but I have a basic understanding of them due to this site.

I don't worry about lazy posters, they expose themselves to some biting reponses at times as many of the contributors here do not suffer fools or time wasters ad do not hesitate to make biting replies.
In fact, I think there is more outrage seems at the multiple posters than the lazy ones.

For students, there is an excellent alternative at though lazy people don't get away with it any more than here.

Eng-tips, whatever its failings might be, is to be savoured for the occasional light-hearted approach in some fora, the wicked sarcasm that is sometimes the response to bad posts and for the occasional blood feuds that flare up (the most notable being the electrical engineering one of a couple of years ago).


JMW

Chris
SolidWorks/PDMWorks 08 3.1
AutoCAD 08
ctopher's home (updated Aug 5, 2008)
ctopher's blog
SolidWorks Legion

That's lazy, Chris.

This is a superb thread...

I agree with the above CorBlimeyLimey:

"There's nothing wrong with giving an answer, but the source (a book, the Help files, etc) should also be referenced. A partial answer with a linked to the source for the remainder is best."

A full, detailed spoon fed answer to a newbie is often not a good policy...it is far better to point to an authoritative document and let the learning begin.

_MJC

Actually, it increases the work load. Think about it. For every goofball OP, there's a half-dozen engineers slaving away to answer his question. That's like a 500% increase in work output, and from people not even paid to do the work. ;-)

TTFN

FAQ731-376

My response to "cite your sources" on eng-tips.com is "Pay me and I will". I try not to ever provide sources here even when I use them to develop an answer. I figure that an answer with sources is more work than I want to do for free. I've gotten a considerable amount of work from people liking my posts here and wanting me to do the same kind of thing for them, so my approach seems to be pretty effective for my particular goals.

David Simpson, PE
MuleShoe Engineering
Please see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips Fora.

"Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but not their own facts" Patrick Moynihan

zdas04, I think the question is whether or not it is appropriate to use eng-tips as a source for real-world problems. I don't think responders are expected to cite sources, at least I hope not.

alehman,

Eng-tips advice should not be used "as a source for real-world problems", but CBL and MJC were proposing to share their own sources instead of spoon-feeding solutions. I agree with them. Whether or not a source reference is helpful depends on the question.

In my opinion laziness is useless unless it's well carried out. Then they call it efficiency.

Regards

eng-tips, by professional engineers for professional engineers
Please see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips Fora.

I don't think eng-tips promotes laziness. I would argue the opposite. While I do post questions from time to time, the large majority of my participation on this site is being involved in others' questions and trying to learn from (and help to whatever degree I am able) others. I think this promotes quicker, more efficient learning rather than laziness.
I actually credit this site for the fact that my bosses noticing that my technical aptitude is far above that of my peers (even those with more formal education). Not that I'm always learning theories from eng-tips, but I am certainly exposed to a far greater range of issues and discussions than I ever would be in my office alone and that has allowed me to expand my thinking and use that in my job.