A crack in a MAIN BEAM under a house with a hairline crack in it - Is that concerning ? 4

[bdn2004]

It's been identified that the main beam under a single story home that runs the length of the house has a hair line crack in it in the crawlspace. The crawlspace has a concrete floor. The main beam is 3 - 2 x 10s sandwiched together with 1/2" x 8" carriage bolts every three feet. The spans are about 9'-6" between piers. (Sorry about the bright flash at the bottom). We've measured a deflection of about 3/16". I hardly see any crack, and if anything it's just a hairline crack.

1. Is this crack something to concern with? When is a crack something to concern with ?
2. To shore it up and prevent it from deflecting any more we are proposing adding 2 floor jacks in between the piers. And sit each floor jack on top of a 2'x 2'x 3/4" piece of plywood.
3. Also proposing to add another 2 x 10 on one side of the main beam. What percentage extra strength would this add?

 

[Rabbit12]

I'm with BAretired this is a non-issue. The inspector had to have been looking really hard to find that crack.

Is there any possibility this is a scam situation? The inspector and buyer may be buddies and colluding to make you think this is a huge ($15K) issue. If you fix it based on their recommendations their other contractor buddy comes in and does the work. If you negotiate $5-10k off the price the buyer wins. Seems fishy I just can't see an inspector that even remotely knows what he's doing makes an issue out of this.

 

[kipfoot]

Often, issues that arise from a home inspection in a real estate transaction are money issues, not structural issues. The buyer will be happy if you accept a lower the offer, but will never get it fixed because it's not an active problem.

In this case, the (3) 2X10 beam may, or may not, work on paper (depending on the species, grade, tributary width, etc) but the crack that you say is there isn't an issue. The methods for repair they've proposed show they don't know what they're talking about...or assume that you don't.

If you're in a fair location in a typical US market, I'd say let the buyer walk if that's their choice. Another buyer will come along in a few days.

 

[bdn2004]

Great replies. I like kwinner "What does a real failure look like in this case?" "What would I do if this were my house?" "Wait until an actual issue arises and fix it then if it ever arises..." That's how anyone looks at his own home. We don't go around "fixing" potential problems.

According to the Buyer, a structural engineer did design his "fix". Although I don't see a PE stamp on his proposal. The engineer wasn't down there looking at it. He just had some guy over there taking photos. And who knows if the guy really is a structural engineer working for a place like that. Some people call themselves "engineers" and legally - they aren't. And I do know too...a lot of places with "free estimates" make up with that "free" by coming up with solutions like that. For every 10 estimates, there is one fool who'll say yes.

I think I'm going to say: "After getting some advice I don't think conclusive professional structural analysis and engineering has been performed on that beam to warrant such a drastic remedy for just a potential problem. It's held fast for 70 years now. No one notices any sag or give when walking across the floors. From what I understand small cracks are common in old wood, that doesn't mean they are on the brink of failure. Again proper load analysis, material assessment etc that can only be performed by a licensed professional structural engineer has not been done to prove the point. And even if there is an issue I'm certain there are some more cost effective and less invasive alternatives. I can suggest some simple common measures we can do this weekend if it makes you feel better. Thanks.

If it cost me the sale....that's how it goes.

 

[LittleInch]

I agree. The other line I used when selling a 120 yr old house a few years ago was "This house is 120 (70) years old. There will be some items which are not perfect or maybe not as a new house would be, but the price reflects its age and condition. Any survey / inspection will find some items which may require attention at some point in the future. The price takes this into account and maintenance of any structure is an ongoing item for the house owner".

Your only other option to keep if going is to say what you said and then say - look - to get someone qualified to come in, inspect it and refute your findings is going to be $1000. As a gesture of goodwill I will reduce the price by this much which you can use to do the same once you purchase the property (he never will) and develop a more cost effective solution to a problem which I don't believe exists.

I got stung by one of those "free" surveys which the buyers solicitor insisted on for damp and rot. Unsurprisingly they found some old wood worm and then insisted on money up front to fix it. I was not happy, but was under some time pressures so didn't want to lose the sale. Next time I won't accept any such "free" surveys, I'll employ my own person just to give me a report or at least check them out to see if they are really scam merchants out to get easy money.

If you dropped the price I doubt this work would ever get done once the person moved in and found the floor didn't creak, move and was perfectly flat so the only person loosing out is you.

Remember - More details = better answers
Also: If you get a response it's polite to respond to it.

 

[cvg]

I assume that the buyers agent hired the inspector. buyer is trying to pull a fast one and cut the price by $15k. don't fall for it

 

[LearningAlways]

I agree with the OP, these are great replies. I know little about wood design but feel I've learned something from reading this discussion.

One question, what is "sistering"? I'm assuming it is not what google is currently telling me... a kinswoman or a nun.

 

[phamENG]

Place another joist/rafter/whatever of equal size and strength (usually, could be different depending on the needs) next to and often fastened to a damaged member.

 

[miningman]

You could also truthfully say that you have discussed this matter, along with photos , with a number of professional engineers and the consensus is that this issue is being completely blown out of proportion by your home inspector . Is your home inspector a professional engineer ?? If so can I please see a copy of his stamped report?

Puts the onus on the potential buyer to put up or shut up. And yeah a good will offer of maybe $500 would be a gesture of good faith on your part

 

[epoxybot]

Just out of curiosity, if you were to place a 5 or 6 foot Straight-edge/Level across the bottom of the beam is it true? If so, take a photo and tell them, that after 70 yrs, there is no there, there.

 

[Ron247]

If the crack is what BAretired highlighted, I am in big trouble. I have seen thousands of cracks like that in old buildings and never threw a red flag. If I saw excessive sag, severe unevenness or any other noticeable flaw, I would throw the red flag, but not just a crack an eagle would have to squint to see.

If it is a crawl space, put a "Jiffy Jack" directly under the center of the beam span and call it quits. Place the jack on a precast pad, level on the ground or concrete. That to me would be a suitable repair to make the other party happy.