Activating a wet sprinkler fire suppresion system that was dead for the past 2 years

[trish129]

Hello,
My facility has a wet sprinkler system that serves a shopping mall and a commercial building housing offices.the mall and the building share the same structure and the mall's basement houses the fire pumps.the building's basement is one level above the fire pump room's level and it here that the main header terminates.the mall's basement and the building's basement are partitioned and the main header,after serving the mall's basement Alarm check valve assemblies/sprinklers,terminates in the building's basement.there are 4 alarm check valve assemblies in this bbuilding's basement out of which 3 serve the parking lot via pendent and upright sprinklers and one particular ACV(tagged ACV-D) is for protecting the 20 floors(every floor has a floor control/isolation valve assembly).

the alarm check valve assemblies in the building;s basement had remained inactive for the past 2 years i found many components missing.pipes were rusted,hangers missing.ACV-D was inactive too with its OS & Y valve closed,check valve's external by-pass dead,no water motor alarm gong etc...the system side(sprinkler side) of the ACV-D was found being pressurized by the overhead water tank.i,e the riser downstream the alarm check valve asembly -D terminated in the overhead tank and there was a BUTTERFLY valve up at the top that seemed to serve as an isolation valve.in each floor there are isolation valves without flow switches and pressure regulating valves.


i am tasked with activating this buildings's fire system,from the basement to the top floor. how do i go about this? i will have to do flushing,selection,procurement and installation of mising items,adjustment settings of pressure relief/regulating valves etc.

 

[cdafd]

First question , do you work for a fire sprinkler company

 

[TravisMack]

I would look into hiring a local fire sprinkler company to do an NFPA 25 inspection and testing. That will be a starting point.

You will need to replace all defective and missing components. I would then have the system air tested (provided there is no CPVC piping) to check for leaks. Repair all leaks and then perform a hydrostatic test to see if it will hold pressure.

You also may need to have a fire protection engineering firm do a hazard analysis of the building to determine if hazards have changed from the original design and the planned usages. This may require some system modifications to the system as well.

Basically, you have Pandora's Box. Be careful what you open.

Travis Mack
MFP Design, LLC

http://www.mfpdesign.com

"Follow" us at

https://www.facebook.com/pages/MFP-Design-LLC/92218417692

 

[MatthewJWillis]

What they said. Plus, I am sure you are going to need to go straight to evaluation (NFPA #13). Find a reputable fire sprinkler company. There are SOOOOO many things that will cost you tens times as much (not withstanding if it fails in a fire event), that you will not know to look for. If the system has not been checked and has been left off, (impaired) then you have to go through checking the water, (hydraulic calcs), checking the hazard.., etc. AFTER you have done the testing mentioned by Travis. Please do not attempt it.
You can contact me with your area, and I can provide a list of companies from which to choose. Or you can yellow page it as well. Did I say please do not attempt this?


R/
Matt

 

[trish129]

Thank you Travis and Mathews..

 

[trish129]

There are some queries..

1. the Acv-d's system(sprinkler) side is fed by the overhead water tank that supplies potable water to the office floors and there is a butterfly valve in this riser(that terminates in the tank). this was obviously some sort of make shift arrangment...now that we need to bring this system in compliance with the standard..i.e. pressurization via fire pump..should i remove the butterfly valve? i am also thinking of installing an air release valve here as the riser does not have any ARV at any point ..

2.this particular ACV-d does not have a pressure regulating valve installed..i will need to cut open the incoming branch from the main fire header and installl a PRV here..how should i go about its selection ? and to what pressure do i set it?

3.all floor isolation valves are installed witout flow swtiches and PRESSURE REDUCING/regulating VALVES...though they have test and drain valves there.... should pressure reducing valves be installed downstream the isolation valves or reglating valves and to what pressures should they be set to against what criteria? i am not sure about the sprinkler rating for EACH floor..no documents available..sprinkler,however ,are installed in theese offices..

4.is there any nfpa standard for pipe painting etc?

5.there is only a 1 or 1.5 inch globe valve in the main fire header that comes from the level down fire pump room into this building's basement and that too between ACV's.i do not see any other option than to bleed air from this one..plan: attach a hose pipe to this globe valve..route to to a near by drain and turn on the pump and bled air till we dont see air bubbles. anymore in the hose..

6.should i first DRAIN the system ,install the missing items in these ACV's(like alarm gong,retard chamber,external bypasses of check valves,guages,repair of OS & y valve gaskets,fittings,pressure/flow switches) and then PERFORM FLUSHING while bleeeding air ? for any repair work/impairmnt correction i will HAVE to shut down(by closing all mall basement ACV's OS & Y gate valves that are operative) the whole system and drain(in two steps: by a down-oriented 2 inch valve in the main header that enters the building basement to drain a major volume of water and then by opening the 6 inch return line from the main header in the fire pump room into the fire water tank(spill into tank) ) the whole main header as there is NO isolation valve ,isolating the mall basement from the building basement..

7.what sort of hydraulic calculations would i be rquired to do at any stage?


8.after installing the missing ACV accessories,i will unplug all associated sprinklers of these ACVs and then re-pressurise the system by the fire pump so as to flush the sprinkler lines/branches as well as bleed air..correct approach?

 

[cdafd]

Is the building going to still be a mall and office building?

Besides asking questions here, the ahj may want some things done to the system and building.

 

[Sdpaddler50]

Trish, I appreciate your interest and questions, but be cautious asking detailed questions on an Internet forum. I think this site is helpful for more general queries. It sounds to me like you need to involve a sprinkler contractor and probably an FPE as well to walk that building with you and come up with a plan.

 

[MatthewJWillis]

The very body of your questions preclude me from providing any specific answers. Most states have a licensing requirement to perform the work you are speaking of. More especially since this is a life safety system. Your concerns seem mainly based on PRV and air bleeding. These two items should be the farthest from your mind.
I'll offer one more time, Please do not attempt what you are describing. Hire a professional.

R/
Matt

 

[TravisMack]

I have to agree with Matt on this one. (It is not unusual for me to agree with Matt). The PRV settings should not even be registering in the thought process at this point. I appreciate you wanting to tackle this on your own. However, this may be way over your head - not in complexity, but in just experience as for how it all needs to happen. At the minimum, get a sprinkler contractor to come in and do an NFPA 25 inspection on the facility.

Travis Mack
MFP Design, LLC

http://www.mfpdesign.com

"Follow" us at

https://www.facebook.com/pages/MFP-Design-LLC/92218417692

 

[chicopee]

Since it was mentioned above for a FPE, contact your property insurance carrier for an evaluation of the system since many of these carriers have FPE's.

 

[trish129]

Thank you for all your comments.I fully realise the warm wishes that come tagged in you advising me against going about this on my own.It is yet again a request to please spell out a GENERIC AND THEORETICAL roadmap,YOU,by dint of the wealth of experience with you, would execute had you been in my place.

 

[TravisMack]

A generic and theoretical roadmap is:

1 - Replace what is missing
2 - Fix what is broken
3 - verify

But, it takes some people decades to get competent at this stuff. Trying to do a project that appears relatively large on a first go without any supervision is likely going to be troublesome. As I said above, you have Pandora's Box. Be careful what you open.

Travis Mack
MFP Design, LLC

http://www.mfpdesign.com

"Follow" us at

https://www.facebook.com/pages/MFP-Design-LLC/92218417692

 

[MatthewJWillis]

Trish, if you have a copy of NFPA #25, then I would suggest reading it. The are Generic and Theoretical roadmaps in there by way of charts and tables.
It is impossible to say where to start. You have missing items. These must be replaced. If you do not use the exact item, you need to read NFPA #13.
I promise you we are not being difficult. It really is that complex if you do not have Years of experience and certification.

An example Trish, when I am asked how much a Fire Sprinkler System costs. I turn around and ask how much is a car.
Then you start to understand a small score of the variables associated with these systems.

You have Automotive after your name I just remembered. I will try and ask a question along the automotive line.

My front right tire will not rotate. I am missing pieces of equipment under the hood. The reading at the exhaust pipe is 0.00cfm. Where should I start?

The offer still stands to get you in contact with someone in your area....


R/
Matt
(30 years this year....)

 

[fireguy519345]

NFPA 25-2014 is available with commentary that explains what to do and why to do it.

http://www.nfpa.org/codes-and-standards/document-information-pages?mode=code&code=25

Call NFPA @ 1-800-344-3555 and tell them you want a NFPA 25-2014 Handbook.

 

[cdafd]

Part of the road map includes

Talking to the ahj to see what they want