B31.3 Materials 2

[GemmellG]

Is there any paragraphs in ASME B31.3 such as ASME Sec 1 PG-11.1 that allows the use of materials without material test reports. I have a blind flange I would like to use it has all the required markings but no MTR.

 

[Duwe6]

Flanges and other fittings are assumed to be acceptable to the spec you find stamped into them. That's why so many of us refuse to use parts from known counterfitters - cough[china]cough.

If I bought that flange from a reputable supplier, I would use it. Assuming that it was stamped A-105 and B16.5.

 

[DekDee]

Interpretation: 21-03
Subject: ASME B31.3-2004, Paras. K323.1.5, Product Analysis and K346.2(b), Required Records
Date Issued: March 29, 2006
File: 06-298
Question: Does ASME B31.3-2004 require any Certified Material Test Reports (CMTR)?
Reply: No; however, see paras. K323.1.5 and K346.2(b).

Hope that helps,
Cheers,
DD

 

[LalitMohanKothari]

just do the PMI for material verification ..and dimensions check then you can use ...
Manufacturer marking is also in punching you also can ask for MTC i.e. 3.1 or 3.2


Lalit Mohan Kothari
TUV NORD
“Dreams and dedication makes powerful combination “

 

[jte]

Lalit-

What PMI device or method would you recommend to Gemmell that would help to distinguish a 70 UTS carbon steel plate from a 55 UTS carbon steel plate?

 

[moltenmetal]

Umm, the flanges aren't made from plate, so how is this relevant? Piping components here, not vessel components. ASME VIII has fairly strict traceability and documentation requirements, whereas B31.3 permits markings on FITTINGS to be trusted as noted. The exception, and where we draw the line, is for PIPE itself, for which MTRs are pretty much a requirement because the markings aren't on every portion of that pipe, nor are they made in a durable fashion.

 

[jte]

Well, strictly speaking, one could easily build a Section VIII-1 vessel without MTR's. Section VIII-1 allows for markings (permanent or otherwise) on fittings and pipe to be considered good enough if so stated in the fab shop's QA manual. As for B31.3, I am not aware of a requirement for an MTR in this code - even for piping fabricated of rolled plate. While owner/users may wisely choose to add this as a requirement for their projects, it is not an ASME requirement.

The OP was asking about a blind flange, which could easily be fabricated of plate material.

But I'd still like to know what PMI device could distinguish between grades of the same specification of steel. Simply put, I'm not aware of any such thing - but I am not a specialist in that field. In some cases there could be substantial value in simply identifying one carbon steel spec from another, e.g. A53 from A106.

 

[weldtek]

Nor am I. Pretty much impossible by PMI, especially considering that many such materials are certified to multiple specifications by the mill.
We regularly see MTR's certifying a pipe to API 5L, A53 and A106.

 

[Duwe6]

For distinguishing grades of carbon steel, you have to know Carbon content. Sounds simplistic & easy; it's not. XRF - xray fluorescence - 'gun' cannot give Carbon [or Nitrogen]. So you have to go to a more physical test - these machines used to use a spark, and left an 'arc strike' to deal with. Current ones use plasma or laser, so you get left with a small, smooth divot. I usually refer to this as 'semi-nondestructive' testing. The fitting/pipe is slightly marred, but usually nobody worries about a small, smooth blemish.

Also, it doesn't about multiple certifications. Ignore all of the overlapping ones except the one you need. Either the material in question meets that spec, or it doesn't. In my experience, the off-spec materials have been 5- and 9-Chrome [too lean], 316 stainless [too lean, too little Molly], and gold wedding rings [12-karat, instead of 18-k].

 

[moltenmetal]

If a company is going to the bother of putting an ASTM/B16 marking on a component which doesn't meet the spec, do you think they are capable of also generating a fraudulent mill cert? We've seen it...

The question was whether or not B31.3 requires mill certs for B16 piping components with durable markings. The answer to that question has been provided, and it's no. It's a popular myth that MTRs for such components is a code requirement rather than a client preference.

As to the usefulness of PMI, Duwe6 has outlined it pretty well. Note that some XRF machines are blind to fairly heavy elements such as Ti and hence can't distinguish 321 from 304 etc. They absolutely cannot do carbon content.