Career advice for an entry level engineer 11

[PaKaz]

Hey guys,
I am new to this forum. So, I don't know if this is a right place to ask this question. I got my B.S. in Structural Engineering last year and I have been working at a Timber Industry for over a year now. Recently, I am thinking about going back to grad school, but the question is if I should do my MS in engineering or get MBA. My long term career goal is to become a project manager or managing principle. I asked couple of engineers and some said to get MBA since engineers usually don't have enough management and market knowledge to become a good manager and other said, MBA is overstated and I should go for MS in engineering to move up. In my personal opinion, I think I should get MBA with PE or SE license. What you guys suggest for this situation? Your suggestion on this matter will be really helpful.

Thanks,

 

[HVACctrl]

I can see it going either way. I just got my PE license. My choice would be to go MBA next, if any. It seems most of what I have learned in school and while studying for the PE license isn't even used at the workplace. I would think the MS in Engr would be just more of the same.

I think the MBA would make me more rounded and capable of more easily being accepted into management, etc...

That's just my take. Others will certainly see it differently. It will depend on your industry, your job aspirations, etc.... It might even depend on the individual looking at your resume.

Go for the PE for sure either way. Particularly in structural, it seems to be important- although the structural PE exam appears to be fairly difficult.

Ed

http://www.engineerboards.com

 

[JAE]

I would say that the MS vs. MBA depends a lot on which part of the industry you are heading towards.

If you are hoping to go into consulting engineering, with an A/E, E, or E/A firm, I would probably go with the MS in structural engineering. The MS is getting quite important for the Structural discipline - it helped me considerably to be a much much better engineer than I ever would have been with a BS only. With the MS, you can develop yourself into a good engineer, get licensed, and you will eventually move into management, project management or marketing as you get older.

With an MBA only, you get a lot of business savvy, but I would question whether you would ever become a good structural engineer.

There's nothing worse than an engineering manager who doesn't understand his/her discipline very well.

I have a friend with an MS in Structural who, after working a few years, went on to get an MBA while working. Our current president is an architect who just got his MBA.

 

[PaKaz]

Thanks a lot for your help HVACctrl and JAE. Question for JAE, Is getting a M.S. in structural gave you significant salary increase? and does the school makes a great difference for M.S. if you are already in the working field?

Thanks,

 

[l3city]

Check thread731-162299, this is a very similar situation. This might help a lot:

Regards

 

[JAE]

PaKaz. I guess I can only speak for myself, but going from being a graduate with a B.S. to a graduate with an M.S. was night and day for me. I felt that "all the light bulbs went off" in my head after getting the M.S. and my confidence, ability to learn and grow, and my deeper understanding of design and analysis issues really helped.

So it definitely made me a much better engineer.

If you study some of the salary surveys out there, I think that in structural, the MS may get a bit of a boost in salary compared with B.S., perhaps $2000 to $4000 per year. The separation between the two stays about the same and maybe grows narrower in later years.

The big difference, in my view, is that the MS opens many more doors of opportunities (in structural) than the BS. I manage a small structural engineering department and generally will not even consider hiring BS graduates. This is true of some of my other manager friends out there as well.

 

[PaKaz]

Thanks for your answer JAE. I was wondering does the school makes a big difference in MS. After I graduated, I was working for a small architectural firm, and I hate it. Soon after that I interviewed at another small firm, but the pay was terrible. At that point, I was thinking of making a career move until I got my current job. I love my current job in the Timber industry, but here I really don't do any big structural design project. Mainly I do retrofit work for residential houses, but there is nothing exciting happens on a daily basis. I feel like I am not getting enough design experience to prepare for my PE. That's why I wanted to try out working for a Structural Engineering firm.

I was thinking of getting my M.S. in Structural Engineering at San Diego State University while I work for a firm, because they offer part time program at night. Question is will it look bad on my resume since I got my B.S. from UC San Diego which is much more reputable school than SDSU?

 

[JAE]

I can't answer for the two schools....usually you hear the advice to always go to a different grad school than your undergrad school but I didn't - went to the same school for both with a 2 year work experience between them. That 2 year work period really helped me as after your BS degree most students are pretty burned out on studying and also very poor.

I'd check out the placement statistics of SDSU to see how they fare. Also, call some area-wide SE's to see if there is any sort of "reputation" for either school...how they compare, how well their grads do, etc.

 

[KENAT]

Personally I'm inclined to think MBA are over rated but that may not be reflected in the job market.

Most of the better mangagers I've had didn't have an MBA. Some of the useless ones did, or other higher business qualifications.

Just my 2C/P

 

[Senselessticker]

I suggest working for another year before making a decision. 1 year in engineering is almost the same as zero experience. Give it another year and decide which side of the business you really like best. If you want to be a manager, go do an MBA (but do it on the side). If you really want to pursue the engineering side, go for an MS.

I think every structural engineer where I work has a master's, the rest are considered interns even if they have a B.S. This is not the case for other disciplines. Most of the electrical, mechanical, and civil folks have only a B.S. The structural department will not even hire someone full time who doesn't have a master's. I've always wondered why an M.S. in structural seems to be so important.

 

[johnsmith2]

My opinion is: Don't get the MBA until you have at least five years working experiences. MBA provides someone who already have the technical background to increase the management knowledge. For example, if you work as product manager, you need to understand the products develeopment, principal, and also the marketing skills. So, the average age of MBA student, at least 30-35.

 

[PaKaz]

Thanks for all your help. I really appreciate it.

 

[dik]

You should have gone into medicine... hours aren't as brutal, pay is better and liability is less... <G>

Dik

 

[PaKaz]

He he he dik. I have to disagree with you on that. Two of my best friends are doctors, and there hours are brutal since they work in the ER, and liability is much higher than us but that's why they get better salary.

 

[PaKaz]

JAE, Did your work experience helped you toward admission for your grad school?

 

[JAE]

I don't think so ... as far as admission goes. I simply called my professor and asked him about what sort of things I would need to do to get accepted into grad school. He knew I'd been working for two years, but I do believe he was seeing a local guy from the home state who was willing to pay his way through that he did everything he could to get me in.

But the work experience did a LOT for my grad studies, as I was hungry then to really get into structural engineering while some of my other fellow classmates, who went straight through from undergrad, were quite burned out on studying.

 

[wes616]

something to think about...

a survey i one read said

engineers from 0 - 5 years experience wish they had more technical understanding, and wished they took more technical courses.

engineers from 5 -15 years wish they had more business understanding, and wished they took more business / mgmt courses.

engineers from 15 + years wish they would have a better world understanding, and wished the'd taken more diversity, arts and liberal arts courses.

(just thoughts)

Wes C.
------------------------------
No trees were killed in the sending of this message, but a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.

 

[GregLocock]

Very interesting list Wes.

Cheers

Greg Locock

Please see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips.

 

[PaKaz]

Gotta question. Is it better to get a M.S from ok school or not get it at all?

 

[jpankask]

I would say that unless the school is a diploma mill or has no accredited undergraduate programs, it is always better to get an MS than not to get it at all.

Weighing in on the MS vs. MBA discussion from above, I would agree that it really depends on what you want to do in the future, and that may change as time goes on. When I was in school, I always thought the people who got a masters degree were crazy. After I graduated and worked for a summer, I missed learning and started taking prerequisite classes for an MBA. When it came time to decide whether to continue with an MBA or switch to MS (mechanical engineering), I decided to get the MS. I don't regret it one bit. I thought that I had a pretty good grasp of engineering subjects when I earned my BS. I learned during my MS studies that I still had much more to learn, of course I was also working full time and that probably played a role in the revelation. Now that I have also earned my MS in engineering, I am much more confident, not just in my knowledge of engineering but in my abilities. I learned valuable research and writing skills that I didn't gain while working towards the BS. I also have better analytical skills. These are skills that directly affect my everyday work.

As far as salary is concerned with the MS, having the MS gives me two years of "experience" towards advancement but does not directly affect my salary. What does give me a monthly increase in salary, through license premium, is my PE license. In the civil/structural world, I think a PE license is almost a necessity, if not at your current job, definitely in the future. Do that first.

One other thing you might consider is a Master of Engineering Management. It is kind of halfway between an MBA and MS as you get exposed to management classes but also take some upper level engineering classes. However, it won't get you the recognition that either an MBA or MS will get you because it isn't as well known. Several noteworthy universities offer the MEM degree through distance learning, as well as MS degrees. Good luck with your decision.
Jason