Do I deserve a pay rise? Should I ask for one? If so, how? Thanks

[Cutiee]

Hello, it’s me again, here, asking questions, anyway, let’s get to it.

I graduated last summer and got a job as an E&I engineer in this company last November, so literally I have been working for this company for a year now, I get paid well lets say less than £20k a year as a graduate.

This is my first permanent job, I have no clue how much I should be paid and if I should get a pay rise after a year’s working experience.

Well my company has the reputation of under paying people, therefore a lot of people have left the company especially in my department, even my department manager is leaving end of the month =/

So I feel a bit shy to ask for a pay rise, I work very hard, yet ask lots of questions (don’t know if its good or bad)

I don’t want to find another job yet, I would like to stay in the company and learn. And I really wouldn’t threat my company to give me pay rise or I will leave, because I really don’t want to leave.

Any suggestions?

Thanks


Cuttie

 

[Drumchaser]

Nothing good, hardly ever, comes as a result of you knowing other folks salary. Creates mega prob.s

Don't let the b*****ds get you down.

Your colleage may be performing favors for your boss in private.


Your colleage may be a hog smoker.

 

[ScottyUK]

Cuttie,

Don't cry about it, start fixing the problem instead.

You've had a lot of good advice earlier in this thread from jmw plus the usual load of crap from me but you haven't said how you feel about what we're suggesting. Are you ready to make the big jump? It gets harder the longer you leave it: I changed jobs a couple of months back after ten years at one power station and it was difficult to leave behind all the familiar faces and the things I knew so well, but my reasons for leaving were stronger than my excuses for staying. You need to figure out whether you have reached that point. My opinion is that you probably have but just don't realise it. Once it happens a few times in you career you will learn to recognise it yourself.

Best of luck whatever you decide.


----------------------------------

If we learn from our mistakes I'm getting a great education!

 

[Cutiee]

I can’t thank everyone enough *tears of joy*

I finally had enough courage to talk with my manager, he said he was glad I come and talk to him; he said too many people had problems, but instead of talking to him, those people chose to carry on with the problems, then fed up and leave.

I first asked about what should I achieve to get a proper pay raise, he said the pay review is at April, he would like me to speak to him about pay raise then, so I decided to be straight forward with him about my personal feeling of this unfair situation, he said he had no doubt that I made huge progress and he had very positive feedback from clients regarding my work, he would investigate the situation and get back to me within two weeks, I don’t know what’s going to happen…


Cuttie

 

[jmw]

You've now done the right thing and he knows you are concerned and, more importantly, he and you both see that you have proven your value.

Now you need to see if he will turn good intentions into good deeds.
If he seems to think that April is when the awards are and that April is the time to discuss it, he probably lives in a different world to the rest of us (but maybe that is how things are done there) and come April, when it is too late to change the budget, he may suddenly be apologetic and sympathetic but unable to deliver the necessary raise because he did not allow time to ensure adequate budgeting.

Just a question, did you have your appraisal yet or is that still to come?
If you already had it, were these kind words expressed at that time and recorded in your appraisal? If not, why not? Try and get it added, these are important comments and they should be recorded.
You are entitled to see a copy of that appraisal so you can raise any concerns you may have about its accuracy. You certainly need it to reflect what he has said to you about your work.

Now the contingency planning.
You do need to devote some time to testing the market place and going to some interviews. Try and get job offers, and these don't necessarily have to be jobs you seriously would consider taking but employers who would seriously consider employing you.
Job offers will tell you what other people think you are worth, you will never win any arguments with HR or management about why you should be paid more because of what "the going rate is". I'm not saying use them to leverage a pay rise, simply use them to know what you are worth and, hopefully, to provide you with the knowledge you can go out and get another job and ideally to provide you with a job offer on hand come April.

By the way, appraisal time is also when you ask about extra training courses and so on. Anything that will help increase your value as an employee both to your employer, who will pay for them, and to any potential employers who love to get your skills as paid for by someone else.

Good luck. Oh, come April, try to remember to let us know how it all came out.

JMW

http://www.ViscoAnalyser.com

 

[MedicineEng]

Cuttie:
Are you sure that your African colleague is not the cousin a minister or deputy in his home country and that his emplyoment in the company is just to get some overseas contracts?

My experience
I never felt extremely underpaid until find my current job. Previously I worked in another company with an official expatriate package, which I felt adequate, despite having meagre salary increases (average 2.5% per year for 5 years) and reduced bonus. Then I moved to another company, new responsibilities, new industry. And in the first year I got a bonus almost double than I ever received in the previous company. And now I am earning 35% more, even if I lost some of my expatriate perks. Nevertheless, I don't feel that my previous company was so bad and definitively was a great school for me to learn a lot of things that I applied in my current job which made me shine. So, my point is, if your company is known in the field as underpaying the staff but on the other hand a great school, then wait for one more year or so and then start looking. It is a question of time that someone with the money starts chasing you.
Good luck.

 

[Cutiee]

Happy new year to all of you!

Well after I came back from new year, my manager talked to me, he said he had made the owner of the company aware of this situation, after all he is the one making decisions, he told my manager that I have to be patient and wait, but till when? No one knows…

I’m already working on my CV, but I don’t know where to get some (free) professional advice once my CV is done…

I only worked a year and a bit, should I put my employment history before my education? Or still highlights my education on my CV?

And just where can I go to find a job as an E&I eng working in O&G industrial in the UK, I have done some searching on Google, not much luck..

Thanks.


Cuttie

 

[ScottyUK]

Stop waiting! Start sorting the poroblem out yourself on your own terms by finding a new position. If your current employer does manage to put something together in the mean time then you haven't lost anything, and if they don't then you are that much closer to finding a new job.

I don't mind having a look over your CV if we can figure a way of not infringing the site rules by posting email addresses. Obviously I'm not 'professional' in the sense of being a recruiter (there's an oxymoron in the making... 'professional recruiter' ) but I used to choose interviewees from the CVs which HR let through so...

As for looking for work, the power industry is desperately short of skilled people with any experience, and a year in O&G certainly won't do you any harm. It is also about as secure an industry as you'll find in these troubled times.


----------------------------------

If we learn from our mistakes I'm getting a great education!

 

[KENAT]

Cuttie, you'll get as many different opinions as people you ask or books/websites you read on format.

My sister inlaw who used to do CV/Resume prep as part of her job just re-formatted mine. I'm not sure about some of the changes she made, in fact I need to get back to it.

There have been other threads about resume/CV format etc., take a look or if need be start a new thread. You may want to make it clear that you're in the UK and it's called a CV not a resume, or you may confuse some US posters.

Definitely start sending out your CV/looking elsewhere. You've given them their chance, now you need to look around in ernest.


KENAT,

Have you reminded yourself of faq731-376 recently, or taken a look at posting policies:

http://eng-tips.com/market.cfm?

 

[ScottyUK]

That was one reason for making the offer - British ways of presenting things are slightly different to those from the US and I'm sure a British-influenced CV is immediately apparent in the US in the same way as a US-influenced resume stands out over here.

As for the format, there are as many ways to lay it out as there are people. Some people prefer to have no formatting at all but I'm not against formatting per se : often plain text CVs are simply awful to read. Any formatting should be fairly restrained, should give structure to the document and make it easier to read. Good grammar, correct punctuation, and correct spelling are absolutely vital. I can overlook most things but a spelling mistake on a CV ensures that it goes in the bin.


----------------------------------

If we learn from our mistakes I'm getting a great education!

 

[Cutiee]

Thanks again for the advices.

It would be great if you could have a look at my CV when it’s done, Scotty. I think my graduate CV was actually quite good; my professor helped me with it. I’m writing my new CV using the same layout.

As for the spelling… Microsoft word can check them.



Cuttie

 

[HamishMcTavish]

Cuttie, you could try going to the local univeristy careers advice centre (most have them) for assistance with CV stuff.

Regarding googling for jobs - this is maybe not the best route (too many hits to scroll through) but try looking through publications like The Engineer, Process Engineering etc. Are you going for chartered status - if so then ask your mentor or local members if they know of openings.

Good luck, HM

No more things should be presumed to exist than are absolutely necessary - William of Occam

 

[IRstuff]

Don't count on MS or any other spellchecker to catch homonym errors, i.e., using "their" instead of "they're," etc. Stare at each word, spell it out if necessary.

Even if you've only been working a year, that experience counts, so I would suggest putting that first.

TTFN

FAQ731-376

 

[Cutiee]

The story continues…

I got a pay raise, a small one (8% of what I used to get), starting this month, but backed dated to July 2008, manager also told me that he would try to get me another pay raise in April, the pay review month.

But the business is really not looking good, we haven’t had a new project for months, and I’m finishing off my current project… my line manager told me that if don’t get anything by July, everyone might have to be prepared for redundancy. Ahh that worries me…

Hopefully things will get better.


Cuttie

 

[jmw]

Congratulations.
I think.
Actually, in this climate, and given all that went before, I have no idea how to read this.
I mean, OK, a pay rise is a pay rise and a promise of more to come is worth next to nothing unless and until it happens or doesn't happen.
But how do you read it when it is 8% and backdated to July 2008 and in the present climate and specifically when you say you have no new projects?

Is it the grand gesture?

Maybe your boss knows he is for the chop and putting two fingers to the top brass, maybe you were only earning $10k a year to begin with in which case it is a meaningless gesture only, or what?

It's that backdating bit that worries.

JMW

http://www.ViscoAnalyser.com

 

[ScottyUK]

Good news on the pay rise front, but how many jobs have you applied for and how many interviews have you attended in the period when you've been quiet on here?


----------------------------------

If we learn from our mistakes I'm getting a great education!

 

[Pud]

Cuttie,

I employ "shop floor" operatives (UK) and they earn only slightly less than you.

We also do stuff for O&G company, and the machine operators there are on more than you (with overtime).

Employed a sales guy last November on £40K + benefits too.

Suggest you do the ScottyUK and jmw route. You say you don't want to leave. Believe me, you will surely leave at some point - may as well be now - just make sure it's on your terms!

btw - In my previous lives, I never moved jobs for less than 20% extra - often more was obtained. IMHO, it's the only way to get substantial pay rises. Sticking with one employer for a long time is a sure way to get (in real terms) a reduction in pay.

I speak from 40+ years in engineering in the UK - its pits.

Cheers

Harry

http://www.tynevalleyplastics.co.uk

 

[Kiljoy]

I was in the same boat. Started with a company right out of college that was known for lowballing. It was very difficult when all of other the local business were much higher paid automotive industry jobs.
Long story short, I stayed put, made myself invaluable THEN brought up a competitive offer from another company. I recieved a good pay raise. I'm still not "well" paid, but all of the auto industry is shutting down around us and all of the other high paid engineers are now looking for jobs.
Leaving for a pay raise is all well and good, but in this current economy, job security is top priority. However, this is rust belt Ohio, not the UK.