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Historical face mount hangers for wood 1
- Thread starter whir
- Start date
MiketheEngineer
Structural
Only Simpson comes to mind - I think they may have been in business back then. Can you pull a name off the hanger?? My guess is that you already looked and no joy.
Back then - little testing and fewer values were actaully published. Kind of - "Well it worked before - lets do it again" mentality.
I am sure you can get the gauge of the material and try to find something close then use some reasonable values.
Back then - little testing and fewer values were actaully published. Kind of - "Well it worked before - lets do it again" mentality.
I am sure you can get the gauge of the material and try to find something close then use some reasonable values.
Whir:
A few pictures or sketches would go a long way toward showing which kinds and sizes of hangers you are talking about out of the thousands of possibilities. As I recall any catalog of std. sized hangers could be printed on a couple sheets of paper back in the 60's. Otherwise, larger hangers were designed by the structural engineer or the wood fabricator and treated much like misc. metal. Imagine answering your own question if you didn’t have the benefit of knowing what you are looking at.
A few pictures or sketches would go a long way toward showing which kinds and sizes of hangers you are talking about out of the thousands of possibilities. As I recall any catalog of std. sized hangers could be printed on a couple sheets of paper back in the 60's. Otherwise, larger hangers were designed by the structural engineer or the wood fabricator and treated much like misc. metal. Imagine answering your own question if you didn’t have the benefit of knowing what you are looking at.
- Thread starter
- #4
See the attached photo. It's a pretty generic hanger, although the closer grouping of the bottom 4 nails my give a clue if I could find some info from back then. My concern is that even if I find a similar gage and configuration, the strengths will not be the same just due to advances in materials from then to now. I don't have a feel for a safe reduction to take to go along with reinforcing the connection. Currently, I am assuming I will have to put blocking around the connection and frame in a new hanger.
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1
- #6
SlideRuleEra
Structural
If they are TECO hangers, and it looks like they are, they are still available. Here is a link to the manufacturer's website, including allowable loads:
Your photo may be "PH210" (12 nails in to the header, 6 into the joist). Perhaps you can measure hanger thickness (with micrometer or vernier caliper) to narrow down the choices.
![[idea]](/data/assets/smilies/idea.gif "[idea] [idea]")
![[r2d2]](/data/assets/smilies/r2d2.gif "[r2d2] [r2d2]")
Your photo may be "PH210" (12 nails in to the header, 6 into the joist). Perhaps you can measure hanger thickness (with micrometer or vernier caliper) to narrow down the choices.
Whir:
Regarding the photo, two things strike me: the 2x? jst. has not been loaded sufficiently to really seat it on the hanger bearing surface; and it appears they used roofing nails, likely of dubious character and specs., to do the nailing, although they did at least fill all the holes. The controlling design feature of most of these hangers was the proper size and length of nails, filling all of the holes, to get their full design value. Then they picked a steel gage so it didn’t control.
I’m not quite sure I understand what you are trying to do, what with the blocking, safe reductions, matching hanger strengths, and the like. What size are the wood members and do you know their stress grade? What are the dimensions of the hanger? Pull one of the nails into the 2x jst. to confirm their length and dia.
Hokie, I skipped right past TECO, thinking split rings and shear plates, etc. But, they did have a line of jst. hangers too. But, from the late 60's their hangers and Simpson’s hangers appear more detailed in terms of staggered nail spacing, shaping, cutouts and the like. And, the 69 Simpson catalog I found was already 20 pages long, so my apologies. Cleveland Steel Specialty Co. had a hanger much like that shown, with nails in a straight line and closely spaced at the bot. of the hanger, and into the glue lam. With 12 nails into the glue lam and 6 nails into the joist, that would have to be a 2-2x? jst. in the photo, to fit with their table. But, their picture does not show the little curved cope in the lower left corner of the hanger. That might just be a later forming, crack preventing, improvement.
Regarding the photo, two things strike me: the 2x? jst. has not been loaded sufficiently to really seat it on the hanger bearing surface; and it appears they used roofing nails, likely of dubious character and specs., to do the nailing, although they did at least fill all the holes. The controlling design feature of most of these hangers was the proper size and length of nails, filling all of the holes, to get their full design value. Then they picked a steel gage so it didn’t control.
I’m not quite sure I understand what you are trying to do, what with the blocking, safe reductions, matching hanger strengths, and the like. What size are the wood members and do you know their stress grade? What are the dimensions of the hanger? Pull one of the nails into the 2x jst. to confirm their length and dia.
Hokie, I skipped right past TECO, thinking split rings and shear plates, etc. But, they did have a line of jst. hangers too. But, from the late 60's their hangers and Simpson’s hangers appear more detailed in terms of staggered nail spacing, shaping, cutouts and the like. And, the 69 Simpson catalog I found was already 20 pages long, so my apologies. Cleveland Steel Specialty Co. had a hanger much like that shown, with nails in a straight line and closely spaced at the bot. of the hanger, and into the glue lam. With 12 nails into the glue lam and 6 nails into the joist, that would have to be a 2-2x? jst. in the photo, to fit with their table. But, their picture does not show the little curved cope in the lower left corner of the hanger. That might just be a later forming, crack preventing, improvement.
- Thread starter
- #9
My worry about putting a new hanger where the existing hanger is is that new fasteners would go into existing holes and you could not rely on the connection. My idea is to mount wood between the joists with screws and then mount a new hanger into the new wood over the existing connection.
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