Issue with a co-worker 3

[wes616]

My company is in the process of migrating from 2D CAD to 3D CAD. As such, we have a number of drafters that are, for the most part working on legacy drawings. All of our new work is using the 3D. As such we are trying to transition our older designers over to using 3D. Some are more resistant than other. One in particular, seemed to embrace this "new" technology earlier that some of the others, and has now found his way onto a new product team. He however, has not gotten to the point of being productive beyond making detail drawings. He is detailing the parts that I am designing, and therefor I am responsible for signing off on his work.

Now I am sensitive to the fact that I am 20+ years younger than my co-worker that is now working for me. I try and give him room to figure things out, and when I talk to him I try and do so in a manner that is not going to hurt his pride or ego. I try and make suggestions more than make demands, etc etc etc. This person refuses to give me the same consiteration. He uses every chance he gets to belittle me in front of the other drafters in our drafting room. I have asked him to make his drawing a certain way, and he love to tell me, loudly, how I am doing it WRONG! However, when I go to our DRM and actually look, HE is the one doing the wrong thing. PLUS, I am asking him to do things TO OUR CUSTOMERS REQUIREMETS and request. I have tried explaining both of these things to him in a very quiet and polite manner. This was just responded to by a very loud and defiant, I'VE BEEN DOING THIS SINCE BEFORE YOU WERE BORN. I am now at my witts end. None of the other engineers here will work with him in any sort of intimate manner. I am (was) the only one.

On top of this, the Engineer Manager "freaked out" yesterday, that he was NOT working on my project, but on one of the lower priority legacy projects. This, honestly was because I had no drawings to give him because I was in the midst of a design (in 3D) for the next step in my project. I tried explaining the situation (both the attitude and actual work) to my boss, but this guy has convinced our boss that we (all 5 engineers here) have bad attitudes toward him, and because of that we never give him any work.

Well I now know why others give him NO work, but I must, OR ELSE.

How do I talk to this guy and get him to do the things that I need him to do, with his attitude about me? Any ideas would be much appriciated.

Wes C.

 

[ziggi]

Wes,
I was under the impression that drafters are easy to find. CAD isn't all that hard to do well, most any kid fresh out of college can CAD. However if he was a designer that might be a different story.
I base this on the manufacturing industry, aerospace might be different.

 

[wes616]

Ziggi,

You can find many things on this forum regarding Drafters & Designers.... and many people have opinions up the wazoo. I don't really want to get into it in this thread.

However I do want to say that a the idea of a person being able to "walk in off the streets and CAD" is one of misperception. Competent Drafters / Designer (sometimes used interchangeabley) are necessary for new product development in a couple of ways. They are another set of eyes on the drawing. They often become the first line of defense between engineering and manufacturing. An experienced drafter has a deep understanding of what the shop needs to get the parts made, assembled and installed. An experienced drafter frees the engineering designer up from getting caught up in the nitty gritty details of fastener selection, hole location, bend radii on sheet metal, tolerancing, etc etc etc.

Someone just out of high school might be able to put lines on paper, but an experienced drafter makes the engineering office run smoothly. If you've never worked with someone who is a experienced draftsman, you are truely missing out.

Like in the military people have really high opinions of officers... leading the great charges.. but it's really the "sargents" that make it all happen so the officers look good.

I think that is why this is such a disheartening situation, because I think our drafting room is filled with wonderful men (and 1 woman) who do great and professional work. EXCEPT FOR THIS ONE INDIVIDUAL.

Its too bad really.

Wes C.

 

[IRstuff]

Who has the fire/hire authority? You?

Whoever has the authority needs to have a "Come to J..." meeting with the gentleman and explain that his ass is grass if he continues to be disruptive and uncooperative.

TTFN

 

[HgTX]

I agree!

It doesn't even have to be nasty. My boss's approach to this kind of thing (not aimed at me--yet) is, "Here's what we need to accomplish here. Here is what you need to do to be part of that. If you don't want to be part of that, we'll be perfectly happy to give you glowing recommendations when you look for another job."

The last guy to get that speech is reportedly behaving much better.

Hg

Eng-Tips guidelines: faq731-376

 

[ruggedscot]

Crux of it is that you have a lazy guy here who is intent on doing as little as possible as often as possible. And he is runnign you down - the power balance is in his favour as you seem not to be doing anything effective to address this issue.

First have you or are you doing anything that would go against you - know your job and do it well - I noted that yuo mentioned that you have some rework to do on a drawing. He may resent pulling you out the mire. But that would be his opinion and he has to see this or be made see it - when you are a team you all evolve and this is what tw is about - he seems to want to flag up the negativity and that is one thing that you need to grip about and you need to take control, dont put up with him running you down in public - if he does it again have a quick look about and see what the others are doing then RETALIATE BIG TIME. The GET IN THE F OFFICE NOW !!!! Rant and really let rip , let him know that youn have had enough and that you want this to stop, if it wont stop then there will be no other option availiable other than to move him on, is he with the team or is he not ? If Not then cherrio bud.

Make sure that you have exhasuted all avenues first talk to your boss if you can and talk to HR - ensure that all know about this issue but dont make it sould like you are moaning or winging - no body likes a winger, This type of attitude from him is bordering on the passive aggressive mentality and can run you down if you dont control it.

Rugged

 

[RDK]

Document

Document

Document

Document everything. Places, dates actions people present everything.

Make notes of work assigned to this individual, make notes of counseling sessions, and get some help from your HR department on the necessary process to be followed.

If you do not religiously follow all the necessary steps it can blow up in your face when you are fighting the unjust dismissal lawsuit because one of two things have to happen The guy will have to get with the program or be fired. The only other alternative is that it’s you taking a walk down the road because your department is not performing.

Use a carrot and stick approach. Offer him the necessary training to make the adjustment to the new technology and whatever on job training that you can offer. Make it very clear that you are serious and that his continued refusal to get with the program can have dire consequences for his future employment.

NEVER GET MAD AND SHOUT BACK. If he starts shouting, lower your voice and be very reasonable. If necessary quietly state that you understand why he is upset and that you will continue the discussion later. When you continue the discussion, start off giving him a letter of censure advising that his behavior was unacceptable. Get him to sign acknowledging receipt of the letter. If he refuses to sign then present it to him in front of a witness, preferably from the HR department and get them to sign as a witness that he was censured for unacceptable behavior and that he was made aware of the unacceptable behavior.

Did I mention that you will have to document everything, work assignments, work that he is actually doing, his response to any and all directions?

If nothing else a pile of documentation will show him that you are serious and that you mean business. After the file gets about a half inch thick, make a summary and give him a copy of the entire file. Explain that there is a problem and that you are determined to make it his problem, not the company’s problem and not your problem.

Once again offer help and tell him that if his job performance does not improve that you will be taking formal steps to terminate his employment.

Document that meeting as well and have him once again sign a letter acknowledging that he has been put on notice.

Keep it professional and never let it get personal.

Did I mention document everything? I know that it can be very time consuming to do so but it is an essential part of the process.

Rick Kitson MBA P.Eng

Construction Project Management
From conception to completion

http://www.kitsonengineering.com

 

[wes616]

Rick,

Thanks. I learned that one the hard way a few years back. I now doccument rigoursly (in all aspects of my life). Thats what you get when you've been suid 3 times.

I unfortunately have no ability to offer any training, other than from me on the weekends. I have offered this to anyone who wants it on 5 occasions - (especially since I have taught a course on this particular software at a local college).

I have done all I can do. At this point it is out of my hands.

Wes C.

 

[stevenal]

Wes sure is getting lots of ideas for dealing with a subordinate. But the question dealt with a coworker. Anyone care to redraft their response?

 

[ruggedscot]

Sorry me got a little side tracked thought it was a subordinate.

A co-worker is a tad harder but as RDK said document and then document some more, also if as it can be seen there is an issue then there is the course of bullying at work and work place ethics, I know that I hate the general parasitic nature of HR but in this instance you should make full use of the availiable options - alos if you are a union shop then there could be recourse there as you could work through these issues and get someone on your side - its about sides and you need to make that clear - you need to be on the right side and get this guy to task and if not then ensure that there is enough evidence there to assist the company in its efforts to let him go.

Rugged

 

[wes616]

To clear this up guys. Both answers are correct. He is a co-worker, and in this situation, a subbordinate. We are actually under a different management structure, so I can not directly influence his "career" however, he can influence mine, by not doing what I need.

Anyway, to hell with him.. I'm moving to TEXAS!

Wes C.

 

[HgTX]

There goes the neighborhood!

Hg

Eng-Tips guidelines: faq731-376

 

[ewh]

Welcome Wes! Lots of aerospace work down here.

 

[wes616]

Thanks Ewh,

My wife has gotten a job, thats why we are moving. I however my be pushin palms for a while. Got a couple of hits for, "can you start tomorrow" contract work. But I'm still working out here until the 15th.

Wes C.

 

[wes616]

15th of october

Wes C.

 

[ewh]

Wes,
What part of Texas?

 

[wes616]

Ewh,

She's working at some bigwig Architecture firm in Dowtown Dallas, but we are looking at moving outside the city... as we have some livestock... so we are looking SW of Dallas, so I could look in Dallas & Ft. Worth.

I know there is some work in Waco... think that's a long commute though... (unless we move 1/2 way)....

She has an old high school frind that works at Bell Helos, that has passed around my res a bit (I think). My co. does VIP mods, and I know there is a bit of that going on there.

I woudn't mind doing somthing else for a while either. Maybe hooking up with a consultant, or whatever. I used to do plastics (consumer product), but I love transportation systems....

Anyway... what part of Texas are you in... I'm looking for some (new) friends. (My wife has a bunch already cause she grew up there)

Wes C.

 

[ewh]

I'm down in San Antonio, but the Dallas/Ft Worth area is better as far as aerospace jobs. We do have some companies down here doing aircraft mods. Good luck! I'm sure that you will find something suitable.

 

[Maui]

Your co-worker likely has some personal issues that you may not be aware of. I realize that this may fly in the face of everything that has been suggested here, but I would probably tell him one Friday afternoon you were going to stop at a nearby watering hole after work and wondered if he would like to get a beer with you. I'm not suggesting that you attempt to become friends with him, but it would give you an opportunity to sit with him one on one in a non-work environment. And just let him talk about anything. Listen to him. Just listen. You may be surprised by what he tells you. And his attitude may improve substantially as a result.

Maui

Constants aren't; variables won't.

 

[wes616]

Ewh,

San Antonio is where we want to be (actually by either Uvalde or Kerville/Bourne)... we've been trying to get work there but it seems that the D/FW market has more. It's just been hard to gt interviews from California. No one thought we were serious about going to TX.

Anyway seems she got the first job offer. So we're going to Dallas (unless I get one in the next few days that offers up more $$) -

Wes C.

 

[wes616]

Maui,

I had invited him to lunch (on 3 occasions - before and during this fiasco), and he declined. He may go for a beer after work, but I cannot (you know), plus he his usually gone long before I finish my day.

Wes C.