My intern now makes more than me?!? 7

[ttuterry]

The company I work for started a Civil/Survey department in August 2008. I began working here in September as a Civil EIT. I now have worked 2 and half years as an EIT. It was just me and my boss in the department until he hired an "intern" in January. The intern is going to school for his Bachelor's in Civil but he also has about 20 years of survey experience. To make a long story short, the intern threatened to quit for a number of reasons. Well my boss had a meeting with the owner of the company, and they decided to give him a $10 AN HOUR RAISE!! Of course I didn't hear this from the boss, but I heard it from the intern since me and him are pretty close and are the only two people working for my boss. So I am sitting here with a degree and am quite knowledgeable in AutoCAD and now my intern makes $2 per hour more than me. Everyone I know says that I should have a discussion with my boss about this. What should I do?

 

[ewh]

I agree with the others, this is starting to sound like sour grapes.
While the 20 years of experience may not translate directly, it is still valuable, closely related experience and should be considered as such.

"Good to know you got shoes to wear when you find the floor." - [small]Robert Hunter[/small]

 

[rbulsara]

Asking for more money, usually does not lead to satisfactory results anyway. Best way to get paid more is to find another job that would pay you what you think you should get paid. Look for other job, while you still working and see if someone else will pay you what you are looking for!

 

[PEinc]

ttuterry, if you are an EIT and your boss is a RLPS, and if the department is just you, "your intern," and your boss; it seems to me that you may not be training under the supervision of another PE. This will not help you much when you want to apply to take the PE test. You may want to think about getting out of this small survey department and get into an engineering department before your intern becomes your boss. There's obviously a very strong connection between your surveyor boss and his older, experienced surveyor/intern (supervisor-in-training).

 

[bk19702]

To the OP: Your mind will really be blown once you start reporting to "your intern". That is the writing on the wall that I (and others on here) see anyway. Good thing you two are on good terms. Your self evaluation of your skills does not measure against someone with 20 years experience.

 

[davidinindy]

"In today's market, just be glad you have a steady job. Many of us are not so fortunate. Talk money AFTER the economy imoroves and the availability of other engineers to fill your position dwindles."

Ding! We've got a winner here!

Seriously... Listen to these others. They've said everything already.

David

 

[Pulpeng]

Lots of people make more than me that probably shouldn't. But good for them for getting every dime they can because it doesn't affect me in anyway shape or form. I am overpaid for the amount of work I do - I'm paid higher than people in my clasification (salary surveys for engineers) and I have a nice steady, reliable, fulfilling job.

I say take it as a tidbit of information that obviously the company will pay the right people enough money... then figure out how you can make yourself the right person. Being proactive is the first step on the 7 habits of highly effective people. I never saw complaining or jealousy on Covey's list.

 

[apsix]

"obviously the company will pay the right people enough money"

That could well be the case in Utopia.
Unfortunately I don't live there.

Being proactive on the salary front is the way to get ahead financially, it just doesn't suit everyones' personality.

 

[IRstuff]

"obviously the company will pay the right people enough money" assuming they stay in business long enough to figure it out. People make mistakes all the time, particularly in an unfamiliar situation.


TTFN

FAQ731-376

 

[Twoballcane]

"obviously the company will pay the right people enough money"
I do believe that this is true in the bigger companies, because they have HR with their formulas and such for calculating how much to pay compensation. In a smaller companies where maybe the owner is making the desicions, I can see the "old boys club" being the golden rule (those who has the gold rules.

Tobalcane
"If you avoid failure, you also avoid success."

 

[KENAT]

Twoballcane, those big HR formulas are still written by fallible human beings and use data from fallible human to generate the results. Like it or not, pay raises, like lay-offs and similar decisions usually have an element of the ‘popularity contest’. The exception I can think of are Union contracts where it’s all based on length of service rather than performance, which is as bad, or in cases where the popularity contest aspect is minimized, worse.

There was a thread somewhere about comparing pay, or being open about pay, may be worth the OP's time to find it and take a look.

KENAT,

Have you reminded yourself of faq731-376 recently, or taken a look at posting policies:

http://eng-tips.com/market.cfm?

What is Engineering anyway: faq1088-1484

 

[Twoballcane]

Kenat, I do agree with you, however, I think at smaller companies it is more prevelant that the company (the owener) to give a salary due to emotion than some rational methode such as a large company.

Tobalcane
"If you avoid failure, you also avoid success."

 

[zdas04]

Ever worked in a large company? The company puts on caps and the individual you work for distributes the money within the cap. At then end of the day you don't work for Acme Megastuff, you work for Bobby, and Bobby has as much say as most business owners--and all my years with big companies have never borne out the idea that salary (mis)treatment will ever be anything but emotional.

David

 

[KENAT]

Even if the the money isn't distributed quite like that, normally there's some kind of performance revue involved and if they don't like you, or at least if they like others more, you wont get the higher marks. Even if they try and make it objective, personality will get in the way.

KENAT,

Have you reminded yourself of faq731-376 recently, or taken a look at posting policies:

http://eng-tips.com/market.cfm?

What is Engineering anyway: faq1088-1484

 

[ajack1]

In my experience large companies are more tied in the fact that any job will put you in a band so if you are a C1 you will earn between X and Y and it matters very little how good or bad you are.

Small companies tend to pay the most money to those who perform the best they are less rigid in their approach.

Some people prefer the more structured side of the larger company and some prefer the get it done approach of a smaller one. It is always easier to think someone earns more than you because they are a friend of the boss rather than they do a better job than you.

 

[SomptingGuy]

Large companies are strange beasts. I have known some seriously talented high fliers in big companies that have soared upwards, but never appeared on any engineering org chart. It's almost like there's an infinite number of grades.

The company I work for used to have clearly defined grades and salary bands associated with them. That's gone now ... there was a "management speak" reason for it, but questioning it leads to words like "head" and "parapet".

- Steve

 

[KENAT]

You're right about the pay bands ajack, however there's sometimes some management input into where in that pay band you are or if you can jump to the next one.

This is where the popularity contest comes in.

I've done better in small companies, not 'cause my boss doesn't like me at my current medium (but want to be big) place but because he has so little input into what my raise would be.

KENAT,

Have you reminded yourself of faq731-376 recently, or taken a look at posting policies:

http://eng-tips.com/market.cfm?

What is Engineering anyway: faq1088-1484

 

[MechEng2005]

When I hear about similiar situations, I usually look at what I make versus what is "competitive" for my situation. Then I look at what's available. The fact that some salary survey says peole with my title/experience etc says I should be making 10% more is only worthwhile if I am able to negotiate for that or find another employer that will pay it.

Generally, when I see people that I think are "overpaid", I figure they will be the first to go when layoffs or re-structuring occurs. Typically, this situation arises more frequently in companies that are "overpaying" specific individuals.

It sounds like perhaps you boss has become buddies with the intern on a more personal level. If the boss is steering the direction of his personal interest (i.e. surveying) and not where the opportunities are, maybe it will come back to bite him. If it comes up and your current boss is gone, chances are the "intern" will follow shortly if he is being "overpaid". If your boss is the owner, then hopefully he is going in the right direction, or everybody might be out of a job. If he is the owner, and is steering the company towards surveying and there isn't enough actual engineering to keep you happy, then that is a matter of how you fit within the company. How well you are compensated will obviously suffer if your skills don't match what the company does. And what the company does is up to the owner.

-- MechEng2005

 

[PLCMentor]

I think you need a few more letters after your name. It cant be the 20 years of practical experience that makes him a money maker for the company.

Always, always, compare yourself against you. Then you will only be disappointed in what you are making when it is real. If you think you deserve a raise then ask for one, but never because the other guy makes "x" That becomes a futile process. There will always be those that make more and less. You only should be concerned about what you need, want, think you are worth.

Russell, ABC's

Russell White, P.E.
Automation Technologies, Inc.

http://www.AutomationNC.com

Automation Help

http://www.PLCMentor.com

 

[spongebob007]

I sympathise with the OP. I don't care how much experience the guy has, an "intern" should NOT make more than an engineer. Isn't an intern supposed to be cheap, inexperienced labor? This guy got a $10/hr raise? Granted it was the mid 90's, but I only made $10/hr when I was an intern.

As others suggested, it sounds like there is more to it than meets the eye, and I would not be surprised if the intern ends up becoming your boss.

Personally I would leave and find another job.

 

[GregLocock]

"an "intern" should NOT make more than an engineer."

Maybe but the OP is not a time served engineer (or whatever you want to call it) , he is a trainee as well, an EiT.

So, should one trainee be paid more than another? Should a trainee with more experience and who possibly does billable work be paid more than one 2.5 years out of uni?

I don't think it is as clearcut as you suggest.




Cheers

Greg Locock

SIGlease see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of Eng-Tips.