New engineer: Are my expectations unrealistic? 3

[flyhi]

Greetings all,

I finished my BSEE from a competitive research school in California and I've been working in the aerospace industry for a bit over a year now. Long story short, I'd like to learn what roles and responsibilities other engineers have, and compare them to mine. My day-to-day tasks involve reviewing/approving vendor documentation to qualify parts, interface with vendors to resovle any issues w/ parts, update spec control drawings and a whole myriad of internal one-off jobs. I spend much of my time babysitting old design and outside vendors, but never on new and exciting projects. I spend 90% of the day proof-reading documents, editing reports/documents and on teleconferences.

Should I look for another job or are most engineering jobs like this? I just don't know what is and what isn't reasonable to expect from an engineering profession. Personally, I would like to use more of what I've learned in school and have an active role in design. I prefer 'technical' and not 'clerical'.

Any input would be appreciated. Thank you in advance!

 

[Ashereng]

If you were in the oil and gas industry, in a nut shell, YUP.

Not many "wonderkinds", with one year experience out of school, gets to design anything. I say not many. The truely gifted get to do exciting stuff. The rest of us work.

Most 1 year junior engineers-in-training don't even approve vendor documents (that is committing the company, and contract related). If you are doing that, you are doing well in my company.

What you describe is typical in my company. I would also the following to typical duties:
- photocopying (you would be amazed at how many can't do this correctly the first time)
- putting together job books (again, lots of errors)
- reformatting documents (again, I am amazed)

One criticism of university education I have is that they paint "too rosy" a picture of what the working world will be like for graduate engineers. In oil and gas, before you design a new refinery, you better know how to spec a flange. There are a myriad of information that you need to learn that the schools do not cover. One example, codes. I ask this of the less experienced engineers:

"Do you know all the applicable codes and governmental regulations that govern/applies on your job?"

That sort of puts it in perspective of how much more leaning there is, doesn't it?

In your particular case, I don't know. If you are truely under-utilized, go talk to your supervisor and demonstrate to him/her that you can do more. Then, maybe you will get more responsibility.

Oh, one other thing. Sometimes, it's not you. Rembemer, Jan Ulrich? He is a great rider. He finished 2nd to Lance Armstrong 5 times (or is it six?). Anyway, if Lance is in the same race as you, you won't win. If there is a "star" in your company, maybe you would need to go elsewhere.

Like I said, it's tough to tell. You need to accurately evaluate your situation, your capabilities, and your future development.

80% of respondents believe they are above average. The othre 20% lie. ;-)

"Do not worry about your problems with mathematics, I assure you mine are far greater."
Albert Einstein
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[TheTick]

DON'T GIVE UP YOUR DREAMS. The oil from crushed dreams keeps the wheels of industry lubricated.

 

[craigmj]

This may sound corny but passion has a lot to do with what job you you do.

What do you want to do? What is your dream job? Spend all of your extra time looking for that job and dont give up. If you love to design stuff then just start designing in your spare time. You gain experience that way AND it shows a potenital employer that you have passion. Problem with some people is they become satified with mediocracy...they give up on their passions. Nothing is more sad.

Sounds like your young, so you have a lot of time

Cheers
CJ

 

[MadMango]

Everyone wants the Rock Star job, no one wants to be a roadie.

If you want to stay in aerospace look to get hired by some of the smaller, private space companies like SpaceX, Rocketplane Limited, or Microcosm Inc.

[green]"Art without engineering is dreaming; Engineering without art is calculating."[/green]
Steven K. Roberts, Technomad
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[Senselessticker]

flyhi:

Sounds like your starting a career in engineering...I felt the same as you about a year ago. Realize that you are actually learning and getting good experience by dealing with vendors, reviewing documents and specs, learning how to communicate on calls, etc.. etc... It was about 1 year into my career that I was handed two projects as lead electrical engineer for very high profile jobs. If I had not been learning the nuts and bolts of the business, I would have fallen on my face. Of course...the two buildings are just under construction now....so we'll see how good I did!! Hang in there and see what happens in the next year...

 

[zdas04]

Gimme a break. You've been out of school a whole year and you're not the boss yet so you're thinking about bailing out? If I got your resume I'd have words with the HR idiot that hadn't thrown it in the trash.

Most companies I deal with have a 3-5 year "engineering intern" or "challenger" program that puts recent graduates in a series of company classes and rotating positions before they ever put their name on anything. I've had some recent graduates of the challenger program that you really wanted to have them start over, but most are ok. If you are doing responsible work in your first year out of school I sure hope someone is checking the work.

Life is a whole lot about managing expectations. If you expect to be in responsible charge of the next shuttle launch or Boeing's response to the new AirBus then you will be disappointed.

David

 

[KENAT]

It's come up before. Fact is you need to serve your apprenticeship as it were.

First year + will probably see you doing a lot of apparently menial tasks.

Chances are you are learning a lot, even if you don't realize it.

Try and work our what is common in your company, if it's a large company there may be some structure as to when you start getting some more responsibility/interesting tasks. If it’s a small company may be hard to tell.

Before you say too much to you boss consider this. In my current position we’ve had people complain that they weren’t being challenged (both interns and people old enough to know better). Once they were given something more challenging they didn’t know what to do.

In essence, be careful what you wish for, you may get it!

 

[handleman]

There are other types of design as well. I'm sure aerospace design is tough to get into. Any type of product design will take a while to crack into, but if you want interesting challenges and work variety look for an automation company. I work in the machine design division of a tier 1 supplier. After less than a year I started getting my own projects. Now, after four years, I've been primary designer on many projects, from $50k to $750k. Just be prepared to work a lot...

 

[KENAT]

'babysitting old designs' you can make a career from that.

In it's own way it can be challenging and interesting and rewarding though most people tire of it eventually.

Tends to be a job with high expectations from others but little appreciation.

I actually got given one 'new & exciting' job in my first week and it wasn't pretty, I didn't automatically get the support & help I needed, I had to go ask and of course working out who and what to ask was a challenge. I recovered it eventually but someone more experienced would have done better & faster.

 

[EddyC]

I've worked in several companies since I graduated in 1984. None were aerospace. I was given design engineering tasks within the first few days at every job. After 8 jobs over 22 years, I have a hard time believing that I have been an anomaly. Most other engineers that I have interfaced with tell similar stories to mine.

 

[HVACctrl]

I found it hard to find my niche. I started working for a very low salary. I worked overtime and took what the bosses gave me. I was very subservient.

Keep your eyes open, improve yourself all the time, work towards your P.E. license whether its required in your field or not, make contacts, stay on the good side of all the people you come across, don't get brandished a pushover, nor a suck-ass and I think after about 5 to 10 years of muscling through it all you will be in a MUCH better position to write your own ticket.

Ed

http://www.engineerboards.com

 

[bvanhiel]

flyhi,

You need to find a role model whose doing the work you'd like to do and ask questions on how to get there. Everone here will have their opinion colored by their personal experience and prejudice. Hopefully you can find someone in your company who can act as a mentor, but look outside if you have too.

-b

 

[pso311]

Flyhi,

A lot of engineering centers around pushing a pencil. Don't get discouraged. I'd imagine a testing position would put you in a better spot for what you're looking to do. (Although much report writing, documenting findings,etc.) It sounds like you're getting good face time with your vendors, and this provides you a great networking opportunity.

I believe it was the Tick who wrote "90% of engineering work can be done by a non-eng. It's the other 10% that you get paid for "
(don't smoke me if I'm wrong)

 

[Ashereng]

flyhi,

Aside from the different number of years and experiences between zdas04 and HVACctrl, there is also a difference in industry.

Each industry have their norms and such. It may be that in HVAC, things go faster, and in mechanical, it goes slower.

Aerospce, I would guess (and I am guessing here), I would imagine to go even slower. They are very large complicated projects, typically dealing with government and their regulations, or the defense department with their regulations.

I think another way of looking at this arguement is to take all the comments collectively, and then assess your specific situation. In any data sample, there are always outliers. If you are an outlier (that is, you truely are gifted and can contribute right away), then you should seek more responsibility. If not, then it looks like your current career path is faily "typical" to me.

"Do not worry about your problems with mathematics, I assure you mine are far greater."
Albert Einstein
Have you read FAQ731-376 to make the best use of Eng-Tips Forums?

 

[epoisses]

Let's just blame HR, they are telling kids unrealistic stories.

Flyhi, just exactly HOW do you imagine "being on new and exciting projects"?

I don't know about Aerospace, but in Chemical an exciting project is usually a short flash of genius where someone (usually not you) got a brilliant idea, or a good idea, or just picked the less risky option, followed by anywhere between 3 months and 3 years of paperwork to push it through the organisation and finally have it implemented. The excitement and sex-appeal of a new project is gone from the moment you have documented (or start to document, rather) what exactly you want and then have to explain and convince it to all the other people, and adapt it because what you wanted is not necessarily practical.

The good news is that the more experience you gain, the more efficient you become at the paperwork side of things, so the less time you spend on boring issues and the more on launching another idea.

Anyway, I can only talk in general terms, have a good discussion with your boss about this and let him tell you how your responsibilities may develop.

 

[epoisses]

PS I did not want to discredit detailed project engineering, but at least in my opinion the excitement and sex-appeal are mostly in the early part.

 

[kchida]

Whoa! Sorry, I didn't mean to step on any toes or anything. I really appreciate all the constructive responses though. It's comforting to hear that most new engineers experience the same thing.

Just to clarify, HVAC is correct. In my original post, I never meant to say that I wanted more RESPONSIBILITY, nor did I ever mention that I wanted to be "the Boss". (I suppose I should have been more clear about that.) In fact, I would very much prefer to be mentored and monitored carefully, so as to be given an opportunity to establish a solid foundation. What I did mean, however (and very unfortunately), is that I do not enjoy the type of work I am currently doing. Now, whether there are different types of engineering jobs elsewhere or if all engineering careers start this way, that is what I would like to know. I also wanted to determine the opportunity cost of me staying here (i.e. the 'perfect' job may be out there somewhere and I could be gaining valuable experience doing it).

Thanks again all for your comments!

 

[kchida]

BTW, my screen name is 'kchida'. 'flyhi' is my colleague's screen name. It appears that he used my workstation recently and didn't log out. Sorry for the confusion (I should have checked). Gotta love those cookies!

 

[kchida]

I was just reading the news online during lunch and I must say that there are much bigger problems in this world. This past week has been particularly bad. Here we are on this forum complaining about salaries, job stability, job satisfaction, etc...meanwhile, there are billions of people out there just trying to survive and thousands of innocent lives have been lost in the middle East, Indonesia, Korea and China. Sadly, just as fast as these tragedies occur, we forget and resume our usual whining.