Second Interview question 1

[nate2003]

I am being called in fpr a second interview at a company for an application engineering position. The first onsite interviews were with the HR manager, plant owner, engineering manager, applications engineering manager, and the application engineers.

I am in my second job and both of those I was hired with only one interview. It is a 600 mile trip one way, so they must be pretty interested if they want me to come back.

What can I expect for a second interview and how do I prepare myself?

"I have had my results for a long time, but I do not yet know how I am to arrive at them." Karl Friedrich Gauss

 

[epoisses]

Well the 2nd interview is obviously meant to be a narrower mesh sieve than the 1st one, so you can expect to be put under higher pressure. How they will do that is impossible for us to answer since you have not even told us who will interview you. Preparation is no different than the first interview, obviously, you should only keep in mind what you said during the first rounds because flagrant contradictions are not very well appreciated.

Usually the second interview is done by different people, but given the fact you have already seen a huge crowd during the first rounds I figure it may be the same people, unless they rounded up some senior managers.

BTW What would stop you from simply asking HR this question?

 

[epoisses]

PS since you travel so far, chances are that they keep you there until the decision is made, in which case you'd have to be ready for salary negotiations.

 

[nate2003]

I guess nothing would stop me from asking HR. I didn't think about it. I guess I will do that. Thanks for the advice.

"I have had my results for a long time, but I do not yet know how I am to arrive at them." Karl Friedrich Gauss

 

[epoisses]

you know I travelled 600 miles one way for my own 2nd round and wished I had asked the question upfront, but fortunately still made it

 

[nate2003]

So is it typical for salary negotiations to be made face to face and if so, who would that person be with? In the past, I have had 2 jobs, both fairly entry-level, had offers ofter one interview and took what they were offering, so I have never done negotiating. I am fairly certain that I will have to negotiate this time as I am switching fields and also have been told I would start out for a time as a jr. level engr. I am also expecting a pay cut based on state to state salary comparisons, but that's fine with me too. I am going back to my home state to a company that I have been trying to get into since I was a sophomore in college.

"I have had my results for a long time, but I do not yet know how I am to arrive at them." Karl Friedrich Gauss

 

[melone]

I would expect a very technical interview.

 

[epoisses]

I'm not an expert, all I know is that negotiations are all about convincing the other person, which is all about having a couple of very good reasons. So a very generic and predictable pattern would be as follows:

before the meeting:
- get a very good idea on what salary range you should expect
- determine what would be your acceptable minimum
- think of 3-4 very good reasons why you'd want more than they offer

during the meeting:
- try your best to have them make the first bid
- when they make it, immediately resolve any unclarities in the package so as to know very exactly what you are negotiating
- then make your counter-bid based on theirs (should no problem to ask for 5 minutes time out to do some calculations first) - how much higher it should be is the 64k$ question, say 15-20% if their bid is reasonable.
- keep smiling, defend your position, use your 3-4 reasons one by one during the discussion
- then end up somewhere in between.

Don't think your negotiations skills can make a tremendous difference, but it would be stupid not to try and obtain a maximum.

 

[epoisses]

PS 15-20% might be over the top, I dunno, let's say 10% - it depends also on how far their bid is (and on which side) from your acceptable minimum.

 

[Quantum50]

epoisses makes a good point (several, actually). For my current job, I was flown in for the interview. While I was waiting with the HR rep. for the hiring engineering manager to call me in, I thought, "nothing ventured, nothing gained.". So I ask the HR rep. what my competition was like and how many were being interviewed for this position. She told me I was the only one.

Went a LONG way to relaxing me before I entered the room. Lesson learned? Go ahead and probe for information to enhance your position in the interview process. If nothing else, it shows you take the initiative to gather required intel to optimize your outcome.

 

[Ashereng]

I would suggest that you have in your mind a salary figure. If you do not get an offer of that value, you need to negotiate. If you still do not get an offer of that value, you then need to decide to accept a lower offer, or say NO.

This, you need to decide BEFORE you go to the interview. Although most offers are good for a week (or so), some are not. That is why you should decide what you are going to do, for either outcome.

Making a Go/No Go decision during the interview is tough.



"Do not worry about your problems with mathematics, I assure you mine are far greater."
Albert Einstein
Have you read FAQ731-376 to make the best use of Eng-Tips Forums?

 

[corus]

1st interviews are to determine if your're suitable for the job, the 2nd inteview is to determine if you're not suitable.

As you've already been interviewed about your work then expect the second interview to be about you. They'll want to see if you 'fit in' and if you're likely to stay a long time if offered the job.

Mentioning work or team activities is generally a good thing. Mentioning you're a buddhist monk who likes to contemplate the meaning of your toe nails at weekends is generally a bad thing, unless of course the company is called Buddha-Engineering that designs toe-nail clippers.

corus

 

[Ron]

Nate...don't be so quick to accept that your salary will be lower because of a state change. There are lots of things that make that not so. Argue the p0int in negotiation that cost of living variables are way to nebulous for you to take the reduction. (at least they might show you where they're right if they are!)

Also, since you are changing fields and will go in at a relatively junior position, don't forget that in some respects experience is experience...you might be starting lower at a technical level, but the work environment and people interaction you already have experienced count for something as well, so don't be so quick to take a lower salary just because of that. You'd be surprised at how much technical overlay there is between engineering disciplines, and for that matter, between the engineering process and other stuff in life/business. Point out to them that your "ramp up" time will be shorter than a new grad and you want to know your salary progression as a result.

They saw something they liked or you wouldn't be traveling that far to an interview. Head up..shoulders back...GO FOR IT.

 

[jmw]

Interviews are not just about them sizing you up, they are also for you to size them up.

If you don't have some good and searching questions they may wonder if you are just testing the water or whether you have a genuine interest.
I would guess you want to know about job security (since you will relocate, there is nothing to stop you asking for special severance terms; at this stage the standard employment contract is not sacrosanct... if they want you, then they have to get you; once they've got you, appathy sets in.
Hiring is about the one time you may have leverage to get what you want from the job.

Be very wary of promises and deferred benefits (except pension, some companies/countries have a 6 month period before you can join the pension fund.). If they offer a starting salary with a rise to be determined once you've proven yourself, you may never get it or get it all, and hey, if you don't prove out what will they do? keep you at the starting conditions? maybe, but more probably they will let you go. Get it all up front if you can.

I personally would recomend that you need to sort out the reward package now and treat it as set in stone once agreed. Accept or reject on that basis; starting an auction (old employer Vs new, etc) is not a good idea.

Be clear what your decision parameters are and go for it. If the job is right for you and you are right for them then it's a match and you are in a strong position now; negotiate. If it isn't a match, and a compromise is reached, you won't be happy and they won't be happy and what does that say about the future?

Search some of the other threads in this forum for some good comments on interviews, job changing, salary reviews (if they happen etc) and "interview questions".

JMW

http://www.ViscoAnalyser.com

 

[electricpete]

If I remember correctly, most of the interview books recommend being very vague on the salary questions. In other words, don't get pinned down naming your price (I'll come for X, or I won't come for less than Y).

Your job is to get an offer. Not to undervalue yourself by naming too low a salary, or price yourself out of the job by naming too high of a salary.

You should try to fully understand the benefits and bonuses so you can combine with the final salary to understand what you're getting.

The first step is to get them to make an offer. Only then can you think it over, possibly feel out their flexibility, and possibly negotiate later. You can better feel them out at that point to understand how firm the offer is and to what extent you risk losing your offer if you make a counteroffer. Sometimes vacation and other factors are more negotiable than salary.

This is not my advice. Just what I remember from reading the interview books a few years back. Things can't have changed that much.

=====================================
Eng-tips forums: The best place on the web for engineering discussions.

 

[electricpete]

So the interview will be a 2-way sales activity. You trying to sell yourself and also trying to size up the company.

I think a very valuable activity would be to go through your notes from the first interview and generate a thorough list of questions to help understand how the company works, what makes it tick, and what will be your role. This serves a dual purposes of helping you further evaluate them and also portraying the right image of a person who follows a good decision-making process.

=====================================
Eng-tips forums: The best place on the web for engineering discussions.

 

[ozmosis]

nate2003
Contacting the company directly and asking just that question ("What can I expect for a second interview..?"), and maybe speaking to Application Engineering Manager directly, should be seen as a positive action. It shows you have a keen interest, you indicate good preparation and more importantly, initiative.
Remember to think "..they want me!"

 

[Ashereng]

I have always answered the question of salary expectation with a number - say $60/hr.

I don't understand why, if you have a number in mind, you wouldn't just come out and say it.

If you have done your research, you know the range for your position and expertise. You should also know what nunber you want, and at what number you will walk away. So, why not come out and say it - it'll save everyone some time.

When I interview someone, and ask them about their salary requirements, I am more often impressed when they give me a number than when they dance around.

Just my view.



"Do not worry about your problems with mathematics, I assure you mine are far greater."
Albert Einstein
Have you read FAQ731-376 to make the best use of Eng-Tips Forums?

 

[MedicineEng]

Ashereng:
This works well if you work as contractor, you receive the money and that's it.
If you go for a permanent position, then the question of the salary gets more fuzzy.
Eventualy you are able to accept a lower salary if the pension fund or health insurance is better, or if the company have tuition support programmes, or if the holiday time is bigger, etc.
It is not only the salary, is the whole package that he is going to negotiate. In that sense, he has to make all technical questions (if not clarified in the first interview) and the package negotiation. As such, he wioll only benefit if the company puts the first number on the table.

 

[IRstuff]

So? You can just as easily identify ALL your minimum criteria:

3 weeks vacation
matching 401K
medical
salary
etc.

versus

what are you asking?
what are you offering?
what are you asking?
what are you offering?

Some people like dancing; others like to cut to the chase.


I went to Cabo a long time ago and was sitting on the beach with friends, while the locals were hawking their wares. So I asked what the price was, then offered $10. My bud lambasted me for not negotiating. So the next vendor comes along and my bud proceeds to show me how to negotiate. After 15 minutes of wrangling, guess what he paid? Meanwhile, I was already enjoying my purchase.

Much of this discussion is tied up in greed. If you get the deal you wanted, why aren't you happy?

TTFN