Socializing 11

[livingston]

Is socializing with the boss absolutely necessary to get ahead? My coworkers tend to go to the boss's office first thing almost every morning for little 'chats'. I don't feel the need to do so as I have already given him, in writing, project updates. Yet these people get more meaty projects. My projects are on schedule and I have asked my boss for more work because I feel underutilized. I have even asked him if he as a problem with my work. He has said no. Does it simply boil down to who he 'likes'? That seems insane to me. Any opinions?

 

[CorBlimeyLimey]

Your boss is human. Humans have preferences. Sometimes those preferences can cloud or obscure "clinically clean" judgements.

Would it hurt you to "be nice" & socialise. Most people treat work as a chore (& much of the time, it can be), but a few pleasantries amongst your co-workers & boss can work wonders.


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[RDK]

In every human endeavor interpersonal relationships play a very important part.

Why should engineering be any different? After all we were humans before we were engineers.

Call it what you want, office politics, informal feedback loops, brown nosing, informal discussion groups or socializing it’s all the same. Consider the social interaction the grease that lubricates the engineering machine in the office and workplace. You would never forget to grease the machine would you?

You have to play the part to fit in and be seen as part of the team. It is the reality of life that appearances are the reality. You do not join in with the team and therefore are not seen as part of the term and your work assignments (and opportunities for promotion and career advancement) are suffering as a result.

Join in the discussions and become a team player both in appearance and in fact which is pretty much the same thing.


Rick Kitson MBA P.Eng

Construction Project Management
From conception to completion

http://www.kitsonengineering.com

 

[kchayfie]

It might be that your boss processes verbal feedback better than written reports and so he has a lower opinion of your work simply because of the way it is presented. It is possible that he isn't even aware of the distinction but instintively favours the workers who talk to him over those who write things down.

I'm guessing you are like me and have a natural inclination towards the written word. Its a real pain in the rear end but its worth the effort to do things the way that suit him and go and have a chat with him. I made the effort to change myself (although it does take extra coffee in the morning to steel myself for it!) and I already feel like I'm taken more seriously.

 

[livingston]

I guess it just irritates me to know that brownnosing 'has' to be done. It is a dream but I was hoping that my work would speak for itself.

 

[PhilBW]

All bosses tend to hire and favor employees with the same personality traits they have. I have never been much of a socializer at work. I will greet people in passing and ask them about their kids, grandkids, vacation, etc. but I don't stop at someone's desk or office just to visit. Consequently, as a boss I get a little irritated when I always see certain people socializing during regular working hours. If you worked for me, you would probably be the one getting the better projects, just because your work habits appear to be compatible with mine.

Phil

 

[HgTX]

Your "not socializing" can be the boss's "rejection". ("Why won't they talk to me like 'normal' people do? What the hell? Does my employee actively dislike me?")

Also, being friendly is not the same as brownnosing.

Hg

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[CorBlimeyLimey]

There is a big difference between "brown-nosing" & being sociable. Your not socialising, could be seen as trying to be superior, aloof, "stand-offish" or just plain ignorant.

Remember, "All work & no play ...."

Also, have you considered that by asking for more work, could have been interpreted by your boss, as "brown-nosing"? How many of your colleagues have asked for more? He probably favours team players & sees your colleagues socialising as being part of the team spirit.

However, if you decide to start socialsing, be sincere. If you are not a natural (workplace) socialiser it will come across as false & will be misinterpreted as brown-nosing.


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[livingston]

HgTx:

I think there is a difference between sitting in the boss's office for half an hour talking about whatever crosses your mind and being friendly.

CorBlimeyLimey:

It seems like I can't win. I am not a 'natural' workplace socializer so either I seem antisocial or like a brown-noser.

It just always seems to me that if I spend time talking to the boss, then that is less time I spend on my projects. He should appreciate the work ethic. Is my logic faulty?

 

[monkeydog]

livingston,
I would suspect you are a younger engineer, and by nature are an introvert. It is normal for engineers to be introvert, we are wired that way.
How can you tell the difference between an introvert and extrovert engineer? The extrovert engineer looks at your shoes when he talks to you.
If that is the case, it is something that needs to be worked on. You will need to talk to customers, and suppliers in a non-work setting. Being able to socialize will help build relationships with your customers and suppliers. I agree with you, BS’ing with the boss for 30 minutes daily is over the top. But taking an interest in your coworkers does help build relationships and trust. “How’s your kid, dog, wife, check out this movie, that restaurant, go to this mechanic” … you get the idea.
Think about it, if you spend 15 minutes out of the day socializing, is it really going to effect you work output?

 

[AndrewTX]

I just had my performance review and there were a few feed back comments about my not getting out of my office enough to talk with my co-workers. Not just socializing, but going to have a face to face talk about a project as opposed to talking through email or over the phone.

Face to face communication is important and an area I obviously need to work on. Sounds like you need to work on that area also. It isn't brown-nosing, just a different method to communicate.

Not getting out more to talk to people will affect their impression of you as a team player as I found out during my reveiew. If you don't want to waste time with social chit chatting then don't, but more verbal reporting is the way to go.

 

[livingston]

Thanks everybody.

 

[dporte17]

livingston:

When I was a supervisor I tried to take all the opportunities I had to sit and talk with people for 5 minutes. I found that those were the best 5 minutes spent during my day. It was those people with whom I had a relationship that I called upon to get things done when it counted. Not that these people were more worthy of the job, it was just that I had a relationship with them that allowed me to communicate with them within a pre-existing framework.

Now that I am in consulting, I have found those skills to be extremely valuable for my firm. Relationships, and the ability to foster them, are more valuable than most people acknowledge. I would advise you that 5 minutes here or there with the boss may be well spent.

Dave

 

[livingston]

If that is the case, shouldn't he request the five minutes?

 

[HgTX]

Well, now, that depends. Do you need what he has to give you more than he needs what you have to give him? You're the one worried about what he thinks about you, not the other way around.

Your boss doesn't have owe you diddlysquat, but the better bosses will feel that they do. You weren't so lucky and most people aren't. Go back and reread Monkeydog and AndrewTX's posts.

Hg

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[ziggi]

Personally I can understand the need to socialise at work, but then again I am a very social person, and alot of my work involves talking to people, suppliers, sub-contractors, labourers etc.

I actually prefer talking to writing, maybe I'm just too lazy to write a report when I can voice it more quickly. I also like to deal with people face to face, emails are too impersonal in my opinion. I do however keep records of certain conversations and in some cases, especially after an important conversation or meeting I email a precis of the conversation with the key points to the people involved,in bullet point. I almost never write a novel about what I did, it wastes time and no one cares if my verbs are conjugated or not.

I also understand that some people are best left alone to work, especially the introverts, if I was your boss I would understand that you work better when left alone and would only ask for periodic, bullet point reports. This way you're happy b/c you can work in peace and I'm happy b/c I have a very productive employee. It's not essential to have all my employees socialising.

Actually one of the guys in our shop, is specifically put on night shift, b/c he is a marvel on the lathes and CNCs, but barely says a word to anyone, we let him do his thing, pile him up with work, and in return we get excellent productivity out of him. I don't know the guy personally, and barely speak to him, but based on his work, many times I have suggested to my bosses that he get a raise.

 

[wes616]

I worked for a company once that had a few industrial designers on payroll. One of them refused.. I MEAN ABSOLUTELY REFUSED, to be issued a company email address. If you needed to talk with him, you'd have to call his desk... but he wouldn't talk with you on the phone... a typical conversation would go something like this...

me: Hey Joe is Wes616
joe: Hey there. What can I do for you.
me: well i need to talk with you about this bla bla bla project
joe: ok, hold on one sec.(the phone goes dead)

Then in my office sprints Joe...

Everyone in the company got the same treatment from the copyboy to the president...

Well when it came time for the post 9-11 layoffs and downsizing a nuber of people got the ax.... Joe however was not included in this: 1. because he refused the email, and the phone so he'd have to be let go face to face... and 2. Everyone knew him personally, liked him because they new him (they thought) well... the boss actually confirmed to me that this is why Joe did not get laid off as well.

I had lunch with him a bit after this, and he admitted to me that it was a strategy that he had picked up from some other ID guys when the same thing had happened to him at a previous company... sneeky devil

... Maybe this strategy would not work today... but it's something to think about...

Wes C.
------------------------------
In this house, we OBEY the laws of thermodynamics! - Homer Simpson

 

[ziggi]

Thnx wes616, I'll try that when I get a bit greyer and ballsier. It's a good excuse to shoot the s**t as well.

 

[Pressed]

Why don't you go into your bosses office in the afternoon and spend a couple of minutes talking about the company, other projects, and what he is doing instead of the pure social stuff? Instead of talking about the family or dog/cat and keep the conversation light to avoid any troubles.

You should be able to gauge what is on his mind by if he continues your lead or if he strays back to your projects. I believe an engineer should have an interest in the company beyond his/her own projects in general.

wes I think joe has it wrong, most companies aren't scared at all to let people go. Normally they tell the person on the way out the door with security on the side and the locks already changed. Some are told they will get thier personal stuff in the mail in a couple of months.

monkeydog: too funny!!!

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[PSE]

A bit of socialization with your boss can help put you both more at ease when you are placed in positions where you need to discuss items outside of the technical arena where emotions can get involved (performance reviews, family illnesses, etc.) You don't have to go beyond the small talk but finding some common ground for general conversation and pleasantries helps.