Steel Connection Beam to Beam Existing Condition

[RFreund]

Which is the better detail or maybe there is an even better detail.

Thanks in advance!

EIT

http://www.HowToEngineer.com

 

[ztengguy]

I like the second one. little less torsion. First one the seat plate should be longer.

 

[jayrod12]

I'm also partial to the second one. It's also easier to design and harder for them to screw up on site.

 

[msquared48]

Definitely the second. I would add "bearing" stiffener plates to the web of the W21 each side though.

Mike McCann
MMC Engineering

 

[ACE58]

I prefer the second one also. The question that comes to my mind is if the remainder of the existg. 12" beam section in Detail 1 is adequate for the end reaction requirements. Additional reinforcement steel may be required.

 

[RFreund]

Thanks guys. I liked the second also. I'm just always hesitant to hang beams from beams...not sure why.
FYI - loads are pretty light ~ 2kip end reaction.

EIT

http://www.HowToEngineer.com

 

[msquared48]

If you need more bolts, you could try this arrangement:

Mike McCann
MMC Engineering

 

[msquared48]

Only 2K? Use your solution... No worries.

Mike McCann
MMC Engineering

 

[connectegr]

The second connection is easier to calculated. This would be my preference for new construction.

But, provided that the cope capacity is adequate, and the flange bending capacity is adequate. The second connection eliminates the need for overhead field welding.

http://www.FerrellEngineering.com

Providing fabrication and erection efficient structural design of connections. Consulting services for structural welding and bolting.

 

[SteelPE]

I've use the first on quite a few times. However, the plate you show as a seat is typically notched and extended beyond the cope into the web of the beam. The notch allows the you to keep the web of the beam whole and while being able to weld the plate to the beam. This detail is covered in "Designing with Steel Joists, Joist Girders and Steel Deck" by Fisher

 

[RFreund]

Thanks for the additional input, it is much appreciated!

EIT

http://www.HowToEngineer.com

 

[paddingtongreen]

The first detail bothers me because the cope is square cut instead of radiused, I always show the curved inside corner to help my thinking. The load is small, but I would slit and continue the bearing plate along the new beam web to develop its bending strength at the cope.

Michael.
"Science adjusts its views based on what's observed. Faith is the denial of observation so that belief can be preserved." ~ Tim Minchin

 

[BAretired]

For small reactions, another way to improve Detail 1 is to substitute an angle for the 4x3x3/8 Plate, say L4x4x3/8 by 4" long with the vertical leg welded to the beam web.

BA

 

[BONILL]

For detail #1, I would provide stiffener plates at both sides of connection to control bending of the flange. Would also extend the 3/8" plata into the web of W12.