Texas and Other US Power Shortages 11

[Mbrooke]

Seems like a lot of people are losing power from the cold:

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/winter-fury-unleashes-freeze-over-022658884.html

Any idea what is causing all this? Besides the weather of course.

 

[crshears]

18 HP three-cylinder Yanmar Diesel tractor and a new-to-us 2012 VW Touareg 3.0 litre TDi here, both of which prohibit starting assist sprays; former uses air intake preheater grid, latter uses glow plugs.

CR

"As iron sharpens iron, so one person sharpens another." [Proverbs 27:17, NIV]

 

[Fischstabchen]

It is a little disgusting that in the disaster thread the powers to be can't be bothered to correct the fact that the state's name is misspelled and this thread has delved into starter fluid. It is like everyone is forgetting over 58 people died. It really feels like politics or something is really getting pushed to the front.

 

[crshears]

With respect to my learned colleague, I'm not seeing any state names misspelled . . .

True, the little digression into Diesel engine starter fluid is tangential, but the fact that technological solutions exist for cold weather starting problems and power plant mitigations to address cold weather operation is not; I'm sensing a more or leas across-the-board disgust on behalf of the participants here that moderate-cost ways to mitigate loss of human life continue to take a back seat to purely bean counting considerations.

Or am I wrong?

CR

"As iron sharpens iron, so one person sharpens another." [Proverbs 27:17, NIV]

 

[waross]

Taxes, Taxas and Texas.
Well if you have to push the point, this is an international forum and we have been ignoring a slightly misplaced vowel rather than embarrass a valued friend and contributor who unfortunately speaks American as a second language.
While I suspect that our friend speaks several languages, I fear that the Texican dialect of American is further down his list of capabilities, possibly fourth or fifth.

Is Texican still part of the vernacular?
If it's good enough for John Wayne, it's good enough for me!

Bill
--------------------
Ohm's law
Not just a good idea;
It's the LAW!

 

[waross]

I don't accept that a discussion of engineering solutions to the challenges of cold weather is out of place in this thread.
A lot of the truckers in the Canadian prairies have Webasto heaters installed on their trucks.
This is a diesel fired coolant heater with a 12 Volt circulating pump.
The Wabasto may be started by a timer several hours ahead of a scheduled start time, or, in the event that the driver is taking a rest break in the sleeper or just has to wait in his cab for any reason, the engine may be shut down and the Wabasto will keep both the engine and the cab and sleeper warm while using a lot less fuel than a running engine would.
Those of us who have experienced extreme cold and seen good engineering solutions for coping with cold weather are somewhat aghast at the disaster caused by a chilly day in Texas.

By the way if anyone follows the History channel reality television series "Ice Road Truckers", you may remember an episode where one of the drivers was stranded for several days and when he was able to continue, he was ran out of fuel before he reached town as he had used up too much fuel running his engine so that neither his engine nor he would freeze up.
I suspect that he did have a Wabasto and that it was turned off to add drama to the episode.


Bill
--------------------
Ohm's law
Not just a good idea;
It's the LAW!

 

[Fischstabchen]

Waross,

You are trivializing a serious issue. I feel this thread is filled it so many nonsensical things due to it being a Texas problem. I am a northerner living in Texas and there is obvious lack of empathy for the people of the state. Morgues were filling up with bodies in Galveston and the last count I heard was 58 people died. Now compare this to how serious the thead in the disaster forum treated the collapse of the Hard Rock Cafe in New Orleans was. No one in that thread was talking about crawfish and Mardi Gras. Most engineering problems don't just appear out of thin air. Someone made some wrong decision somewhere along the line and other people were impacted by it. The fact that the PUC and Railroad commission likely made some poor decision doesn't make it any different than most other engineering disasters. Lord knows that there would have been a series of studies showing the impact of hurricane on the northeast but nobody was running around saying "well, why didn't you just prepare for it. Hurricane Sandy would have been nothing if you had done that. Why didn't you just spend a lot of money and harden up the whole coast? ". You see in hindsight that spending millions of dollars on each well would have been worth it. Anyone that has done any planning can't just plan for every contingency. There is not enough money or justification for every single possibility. Someone has to make a decision and live with it and hope for the best.

 

[cranky108]

And you believe Califorinia is ready for a Hurricane? That might be more of a compair as hurricane typically travel West. And maybe they aren't ready. I don't know. (yes I know I misspelled the state name).

Every year, many people are killed by avalanches, which is also a cold weather event. There is little to no discussion on that. Then again, many of these are avoidable.

We are talking about how many cold weather event deaths are avoidable, and things that can be done, or done differently. And in specific about Texas.

Yes I know people there, but some areas have done better than others. What was done differently?
Is some of the news, just hype to sell a story. I think so.
Could things have turned out differently? I think so.
I also believe some of this was self caused, by people in government office. I can't shed a tear for that.

Lighten up. If the conversation strays, we are communicating ideas, that we feel like communicating.

 

[FacEngrPE]

I just received this,

FM Global podcast sheds light on what the Texas power blackouts can teach businesses about resilience

Valentine’s Day 2021 brought a freakish winter freeze that disrupted power, heat and water for millions of Texans. And the impact continues. What can power companies and leaders of enterprises everywhere learn from it all? Tune in to the latest episode of the ‘Resilience Is A Choice’ podcast where FM Global’s Allan Johnson, operations senior vice president and head of power generation, provides insights from being on the ground in Dallas.

What the Texas power blackouts can teach businesses about resilience, Resilience Is A Choice • Feb 24

Other FM Podcasts

https://anchor.fm/fmglobal

 

[dpc]

Some good background info from ERCOT on the outage in the attachment. Apologies if this has already been posted - I stopped following this thread awhile back. The frequency vs time graph is pretty amazing.

Dave

 

[itsmoked]

Why did so much coal drop off? (5GW)

Keith Cress
kcress -

http://www.flaminsystems.com

 

[3DDave]

Apparently mixing a bit of water and freezing temps with coal makes it a big challenge to move. There was also some hint that water supplies freezing caused problems, but I don't know if that affected the coal plants.

 

[itsmoked]

Ah. Makes sense. i could see that as a problem.

Keith Cress
kcress -

http://www.flaminsystems.com

 

[dpc]

A lot of the coal plants in the south are not fully enclosed. The turbine deck is outside and also the boiler front. Lots of little piping and instrument tubing that can freeze up and ruin your day if not heat traced.

 

[crshears]

Back in the day when I was an Auxiliary Plant Operator in a coal-fired generating station, during winter operation I was part of the crews using sledge hammers of various weights [ generally whatever we were capable of lifting and using effectively ] to pound on the 36" diameter coal pipes leading from the coal hoppers to the feeders and pulverizers of those units in operation so as to clear hang-ups...

Although the plant was in Ontario, Canada and therefore completely indoors, the coal pile was unprotected from the elements. As a result the coal plant operators, despite their best efforts, sometimes ended up coaling the plant with some icy chunks mixed in; being right near the fusion temperature of water and now within a plant whose interior was kept at a minimum 15° C / 59° F, freeze/thaw/re-freeze issues would develop, necessitating the muscular expenditure I describe.

I shudder to think of the effects of that type of weather on the type of plant dpc is describing...

CR

"As iron sharpens iron, so one person sharpens another." [Proverbs 27:17, NIV]