How many have been the victim of lack of full disclosure by their organization in the interviewing process? Seems like things have gone from bad to worse in this area for me over the past couple decades. Everything from springing overly restrictive non-disclosure agreements on the day of orientation, to not telling me that seven day work weeks were the expected norm. Any tales to tell?
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Things they forgot to mention in the interview 27
- Thread starter tz101
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SuperSalad
Chemical
Oh I'm with you there tz101. In my experience, the described position and duties rarely represents the eventual expectations and workload once hired. I'm currently doing most of the EHS management for a facility when that was definitely not mentioned in the interview. I now intimately understand why EHS management is usually a full time position for most companies.
Andrew H.
Andrew H.
To be fair, most job descriptions would fill a small book, if everything they thought you might be doing were included.
The elusive 40-hr work week needs to be examined in the light of possible stresses on the company, i.e., is it a naked grab for more profits or is it poor planning or is it a life or death struggle? The answer to this basic question ought to mixed with your risk tolerance and desire to save your job.
TTFN (ta ta for now)
I can do absolutely anything. I'm an expert! faq731-376 forum1529 Entire Forum list
The elusive 40-hr work week needs to be examined in the light of possible stresses on the company, i.e., is it a naked grab for more profits or is it poor planning or is it a life or death struggle? The answer to this basic question ought to mixed with your risk tolerance and desire to save your job.
TTFN (ta ta for now)
I can do absolutely anything. I'm an expert! faq731-376 forum1529 Entire Forum list
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A lot of my friends' companies seem to have extremely poor planning/scheduling. Their idea is to sell as much work as possible and when they get more than they can handle, they say "welp, time to work extra". They then also agree to unrealistic project schedules.
It's a really difficult situation when the leadership is fine with running everyone into the ground.
It's a really difficult situation when the leadership is fine with running everyone into the ground.
SuperSalad
Chemical
I find it usually to starts as poor planning and emergency fill-in work, and then turns into squeezing employees since the work still gets done even if it makes people miserable and overall productivity suffers compared to if the work/position were filled properly.
Andrew H.
Andrew H.
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RVAmeche - that was my experience, too. Though, to be fair, what looks like poor planning and leadership isn't always. Many sectors of the market are cyclical, and the length of the cycles can vary. So at my old firm, they'd go after whatever work they could get. Sometimes it meant long hours and, at times, no days off for a while. But then when the cycle dipped, it was office cookouts in the parking lot and early Fridays. So there was at least an attempt at balance. Like I said - I wouldn't always call it poor leadership, but it is the good (and rare) leader who can take on those market conditions and provide consistent balance for his/her employees.
Poor planning is often mistaken for conservative hiring; most people hate to lay off workers, so they tend to underhire.
Many of these employers have gone through previous generations of boom/bust cycles where they were hiring people through one door and laying people off through another.
My company went through a massive downsizing after several large contracts evaporated; we lost over 50% of our workforce. Since then, we've been much more circumspect about hiring and firing.
TTFN (ta ta for now)
I can do absolutely anything. I'm an expert! faq731-376 forum1529 Entire Forum list
Many of these employers have gone through previous generations of boom/bust cycles where they were hiring people through one door and laying people off through another.
My company went through a massive downsizing after several large contracts evaporated; we lost over 50% of our workforce. Since then, we've been much more circumspect about hiring and firing.
TTFN (ta ta for now)
I can do absolutely anything. I'm an expert! faq731-376 forum1529 Entire Forum list
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In the interviewing process if your talking to a hiring director or a hr person they have a very limited knowledge of what the people in the business do to earn profit.
If you talk to a manager in the interview process you need to know whether they know what you will be doing by being promoted from within the ranks or if they just manage people and don't know much of the process.
Based on who you get to talk to in the interview process you will get either a clueless description of daily routine or a reasonable description of typical tasks and deadlines.
Additionally all companies have annoyances that come from corporate but you cannot really gauge that in the interview process.
If you talk to a manager in the interview process you need to know whether they know what you will be doing by being promoted from within the ranks or if they just manage people and don't know much of the process.
Based on who you get to talk to in the interview process you will get either a clueless description of daily routine or a reasonable description of typical tasks and deadlines.
Additionally all companies have annoyances that come from corporate but you cannot really gauge that in the interview process.
"This is a contract to permanent position"- I was hired after a couple years when I got another offer and threatened to quit.
'Pay rate is...' (a bit on the low side) Forgot to mention 37 hour work week, no OT. When it works out to $100 less a week, forget it.
'Pay rate is...' (a bit on the low side) Forgot to mention 37 hour work week, no OT. When it works out to $100 less a week, forget it.
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- #14
skeletron, I don't think I've ever accepted a job where the benefits package didn't begin on day one. Of course that excludes time constrained benefits like bonuses and profit sharing based on project goals and similar considerations.
The responses highlight the diversity of the work in engineering. It was not unusual that I worked more than 100 hours a week for weeks on end. It was also not unusual that I was basically on vacation with pay for weeks on end in return. For me, working like this was a major attraction and benefit to the work. I outright hate repetitious work. It's not for everyone but I can't imagine sitting at a desk everyday doing what amounts to the same work over and over with the only substantial difference between projects being the name of the customer. Often times the employer and customer were one and the same.
It's hard to believe a job description and reality being different enough to matter. If it isn't common knowledge about a company out there working like this it won't be long before it is common knowledge. Companies have reputations and one treating their employees deceptively like what's described here will mean the people they're attracting won't match those they're trying to hire.
The responses highlight the diversity of the work in engineering. It was not unusual that I worked more than 100 hours a week for weeks on end. It was also not unusual that I was basically on vacation with pay for weeks on end in return. For me, working like this was a major attraction and benefit to the work. I outright hate repetitious work. It's not for everyone but I can't imagine sitting at a desk everyday doing what amounts to the same work over and over with the only substantial difference between projects being the name of the customer. Often times the employer and customer were one and the same.
It's hard to believe a job description and reality being different enough to matter. If it isn't common knowledge about a company out there working like this it won't be long before it is common knowledge. Companies have reputations and one treating their employees deceptively like what's described here will mean the people they're attracting won't match those they're trying to hire.
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SuperSalad
Chemical
Extra money? ![[lol]](/data/assets/smilies/lol.gif "[lol] [lol]")
, good one. No, I generally take the "what part of my regular duties would you like to not get done so I can do this new thing?" approach and delay what can be delayed. I spent too many years trying to please everyone to fall for that trap again.
No, my previous EHS experience was the training I had received over my career by actual EHS managers. I had some regulatory experience with product registrations/compliance and whatnot, but not business compliance and certainly not OSHA stuff.
It has been mostly trial by fire with limited guidance from the people who did some of it before I arrived who were even less qualified to do so.
Suffice to say, I have learned much about OSHA, EPA, DOT, etc. in the past year and a half which I had practically zero knowledge on beforehand.
So far, I have not had any incidents on my watch, and I think I've been keeping the place good with the environmental reporting/compliance, OSHA training/compliance, etc. I've had a couple inspections and reviews from different regulatory bodies and no major issues have come up at least.
My main problem is the stuff done prior to my arrival. I occasionally come across things where I find myself saying, "So....who did this before and where are the records?", to which I often receive silence and shrugs and it becomes a scavenger hunt and self-guided crash course on the regulations. Even worse is the response, "Oh, do you think we need to do that?", which usually makes me cringe knowing I need to figure it out from scratch.
Andrew H.
, good one. No, I generally take the "what part of my regular duties would you like to not get done so I can do this new thing?" approach and delay what can be delayed. I spent too many years trying to please everyone to fall for that trap again.No, my previous EHS experience was the training I had received over my career by actual EHS managers. I had some regulatory experience with product registrations/compliance and whatnot, but not business compliance and certainly not OSHA stuff.
It has been mostly trial by fire with limited guidance from the people who did some of it before I arrived who were even less qualified to do so.
Suffice to say, I have learned much about OSHA, EPA, DOT, etc. in the past year and a half which I had practically zero knowledge on beforehand.
So far, I have not had any incidents on my watch, and I think I've been keeping the place good with the environmental reporting/compliance, OSHA training/compliance, etc. I've had a couple inspections and reviews from different regulatory bodies and no major issues have come up at least.
My main problem is the stuff done prior to my arrival. I occasionally come across things where I find myself saying, "So....who did this before and where are the records?", to which I often receive silence and shrugs and it becomes a scavenger hunt and self-guided crash course on the regulations. Even worse is the response, "Oh, do you think we need to do that?", which usually makes me cringe knowing I need to figure it out from scratch.
Andrew H.
@RRiver: Really? That's strange. My experience has been opposite. Every job has a 3-month probation period before your benefits (medical, dental, etc.) click in. It definitely puts a guy like me in a weird position where I have to disclose medical information (I'm immunocompromised and require a maintenance treatment every 6-8 weeks) to HR and managers during the probationary period.
EDIT: I did work one job (for a sole proprietor) who hired me a couple months before Christmas. He extended benefits on Day One (and even extended them 2 weeks after the last day) and also gave a Christmas bonus.
EDIT: I did work one job (for a sole proprietor) who hired me a couple months before Christmas. He extended benefits on Day One (and even extended them 2 weeks after the last day) and also gave a Christmas bonus.
My experience is that health, etc., started day one, but 401K vesting was delayed 6 months.
TTFN (ta ta for now)
I can do absolutely anything. I'm an expert! faq731-376 forum1529 Entire Forum list
TTFN (ta ta for now)
I can do absolutely anything. I'm an expert! faq731-376 forum1529 Entire Forum list
The last place I worked, everything started up day one - even vesting in employer contributions to the 401K (100% vested immediately).
Where I am now, things were staggered a bit at the beginning. Access to health insurance was 1 month, 401k was 3 months, vacation was 6 months, bonuses/profit sharing vary based on hire date and other factors (since they're paid out at a fixed date for all).
Where I am now, things were staggered a bit at the beginning. Access to health insurance was 1 month, 401k was 3 months, vacation was 6 months, bonuses/profit sharing vary based on hire date and other factors (since they're paid out at a fixed date for all).
Skeletron,
I spent 15 months with Parker Hannifin in the 80's on one of their projects. The day after I was hired I started with 2 weeks of paid vacation. They shut down for 2 weeks over the 4th and that's just the way it lined up.
Also because I worked mostly as an expat for foreign owned companies or with ghosted companies the rules on IRA's and 401k's from both the US and the foreign countries made them more hassle than they were worth. Although the rules are much easier to work with now than what they were, most foreign companies provide for alternative planning and investment methods.
I spent 15 months with Parker Hannifin in the 80's on one of their projects. The day after I was hired I started with 2 weeks of paid vacation. They shut down for 2 weeks over the 4th and that's just the way it lined up.
Also because I worked mostly as an expat for foreign owned companies or with ghosted companies the rules on IRA's and 401k's from both the US and the foreign countries made them more hassle than they were worth. Although the rules are much easier to work with now than what they were, most foreign companies provide for alternative planning and investment methods.
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