TN changes education requirements for the PE to include masters degree

[francesca]

On July 1, 2007, TN governor Phil Bredesen amended Tennessee Code Annotated Section 62-2-401(a) to allow those with a Masters degree in Engineering from an institution with an "approved" undergraduate program to sit for the PE.

On September 20, 2007, the Tennessee Board will hold a rulemaking hearing to define what constitutes an "approved" masters degree.

The amendment takes effect January 1, 2008 and will be repealed June 30, 2012.

For more information:

http://tennessee.gov/commerce/boards/ae/documents/DesignLinesSprngSmr07.pdf

 

[ACtrafficengr]

So, if they have an MS in engineering, but their bachellors degree is in applied flower arranging, they can still get their PE?

"...students of traffic are beginning to realize the false economy of mechanically controlled traffic, and hand work by trained officers will again prevail." - Wm. Phelps Eno, ca. 1928

"I'm searching for the questions, so my answers will make sense." - Stephen Brust

 

[DarthSoilsGuy]

i don't get it. why have a repeal date set before an amendment takes effect? does that mean someone has to get their master's this winter and start working to hopefully pass the spring 2012 exam in the 1st shot?

 

[TDAA]

to allow those with a Masters degree in Engineering from an institution with an "approved" undergraduate program to sit for the PE.

The way that reads, it does not say that it is required to have a masters. So, does this allow what ACtrafficengr said, or does it mean that no work experience is needed with a Masters?

Your post doesn’t say the same thing as your title. Do you have a reference to see what is really meant?

 

[fattdad]

Something to consider: I have an undergraduate degree in Geology (Colorado State University) and a masters in engineering from Virginia Tech. When I sat for my PE (Virginia 1991), the application had various requirements for experience. For a masters degree from an "accredited" university, I had to show 3 years of exeperience. I submitted on that basis (Virginia Tech and all. . . .). Well their graduate program is not "accredited". Here's the details: Many universities have accredited undergraduate programs, but do not take the effort to get accredited graduate programs. Tech was such a university (at the time and maybe still?).

I had plenty of experience, so I just included a few more years and sat for the exam anyhow. Don't know whether the undergraduate flower design major with a graduate degree in engineering would make it or not (i.e., does approved mean accredited)?

f-d

¡papá gordo ain’t no madre flaca!

 

[francesca]

I posted a link in the original post. Open the pdf to read further. Yes, there is a work experience requirement. I presume that the amendment will be repealed as the TN Board will have incorporated the change into their rules, but I do not presume to know how government works in TN.

 

[francesca]

Sorry for the title confusion; the masters degree is alternate to an ABET-accredited undergraduate degree. The engineering technology and foreign undergrad people will be able to get masters degrees instead of having to make up deficiencies as trivial as (in my case) humanities in order to sit for the PE.

 

[DarthSoilsGuy]

they are not requiring that BSEs get Masters to sit for the PE like that debate that got shot down about five years ago.

The way i read the article it appears that it is an additional path for people that don't have an accredited BSE but get a Masters from a school with ABET accreditation.

after thinking about it, i remember about half of my TA's were getting their MS or PHD in engineering, but did their undergrad in Europe and Asia. I guess this will help kill the hurdle of having to pay for their undergrad evaluation and i could see how it would make one feel more welcomed in the USA engineering community. perhaps there's a psychological element to keeping them from leaving america for work and taking knowledge with them.

 

[fattdad]

And again I warn - how many graduate schools actually have an ABET-accredited program? I'll bet you're surprised!

f-d

¡papá gordo ain’t no madre flaca!

 

[BelspringKen]

I graduated from an Engineering Technology program. I did not have to take any additional classes, but had to have 6 years of work experience for the exam. Everytime I hear the master's degree before the PE mentioned, I ask
" why not make everyone WORK 6 years before the PE? "

 

[Stoph]

Ohio requires 8 years experience with a Engineering Technology degree.

 

[jorton]

My understanding of the accreditation issue is that ABET only accredits programs, not degrees, and they only accredit one program per school. Since the majority of students served are undergraduates, usually the undergraduate program is accredited. However, if one program is accredited, most entities recognize both programs.

Last year Alabama changed their requirements for the PE. Starting in 2010 (I think) applicants will be required to have at least 30 hours in addition to work experience and BSCE. The thirty hours is about equivalent to a MS. This is from memory so please correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[semo]

jorton is correct. A lot of states are following the recommendations pushed by NSPE and other professional organizations that want to, in addition to the BS and 4 years work experience, include what they term as a Body of Knowledge (BOK) which covers the 30 additional hours of schooling. I believe they knock off 1 year of experience though.

They credit the reasoning behind this move as the college education system is not teaching our youth the quantity that they once did. It seems to me to be a way for the colleges to make additional money by requiring a MS degree for registration.

I read where our society is hurting for engineers so lets make it harder to become one. Don't get me wrong; I don't think we should make it easier and harm our profession; but, adding 30 hours seems extreme. Especially given the fact most engineers really have to learn their profession after they graduate from school.

 

[BigH]

semo has hit a nerve. MONEY. Remember in a murder case? -follow the money. Same with this and pdh's.

 

[civilperson]

Was not Tennesse the State that legislated pi to be 3.0 for ease in doing geometry?

 

[DarthSoilsGuy]

civilperson, gotta work on that fact-checkin.... it was alabama. (there is a literary reference to tennessee in the article)

http://www.snopes.com/religion/pi.asp

 

[BigInch]

No. It was TN that mandated creationism to eliminate the study of evolution.

I imagine it will make for fewer engineers requesting registration in TN while increasing those registering in surrounding states. Probably not a bad idea, if its true that academic experience can be substituted for working experience. I think a balance of both is necessary.

http://virtualpipeline.spaces.msn.com

 

[francesca]

Did any of you read the article or the thread? Or did you just misunderstand the title (which I have apologized for)? I imagine that many foreign PhDs and MS students will flock to TN to get registration instead of having to go through the abominable undergraduate degree evaluation fiasco. And no, TN has not mandated creationism, but they did vote with a 60% majority to ban gay marriage. I don't know if I prefer institutionalized bigotry over institutionalized idiocy, but I won't be relying on the government to educate my children.

 

[HgTX]

It was Kansas that allowed the teaching of creationism in science classes. I'm just correcting the statement about TN, not encouraging a discussion of creationism vs. evolution...

Hg


Eng-Tips policies: faq731-376

 

[rconner]

DarthSoilsGuy, while I guess the Alabama legislature could be more accurately credited with other remarkable stuff it is my reading Snopes says that particular story is FALSE (the Alabama reference was reportedly fictional writing, circulated as the result of an issue out of New Mexico).