Tug of war...me or company 6

[deveng100]

A situation:
A meeting where your boss is telling some bull**** before prospective client, which you know that if client discovers later, may result in end of contract and opportunity.
That means a loss to company.
And you know that your boss is stupid arrogant creature who only see that no one opposes him any time for reason whatsoever..
So what should a person do ..oppose his boss or say be a silent spectator

 

[KENAT]

Option 3: Look for a new job.

KENAT, probably the least qualified checker you'll ever meet...

 

[deveng100]

Kenat,

Most expected answer...
But we face this typical scenario every now or then...
You know earth is fool's paradise as well...
We can not keep changing jobs

 

[l3city]

Very tough, been there. I kinda' know what you're going through. My ex-boss is like that (he in fact lost lots of clients for his s.t.u.p.i.d attitude towards people) Yeah, it was not even my company, but I am a person, and felt very bad for prospective clients, and a couple of times I talked to them apologizing for my bosses' bull***t. Later, I started looking for another place to work, no matter what the pay was, as long as I could get out of there as soon as possible!! I recommend you do the same thing, otherwise this can emotionally and psicologically affect you.

My $0.02 cts, regards

 

[TheTick]

You work for your boss (and his company). You do not work for the customer. Your only ethical choices are shut up or get out.

 

[MadMango]

A modified Option 3, approach your boss (away from the client) to raise your concerns, if he directs wraith upon you move on.

I have seen this many times. Sometimes the boss is totally clueless, and the entire company has to make his pipe dream come true. If they can't, the company will suffer. If they pull it off, nothing is learned and you repeat the process.

Some people manage this way, their version of motivating the troops. They tend to remain while others move on.

"Art without engineering is dreaming; Engineering without art is calculating."

Have you read faq731-376 to make the best use of Eng-Tips Forums?

 

[deveng100]

You know there is difference between stakeholder and employee..even though employee is a subset of stakeholder..
I mean to say even though I work for boss..me and my boss both work for company..
Or it can be put like this
My boss's ego (my profit){he is happy with me}
OR my company's profit (my loss) {he is furious }

 

[sms]

I draw the line at safety. If the boss, or anyone else is making a decision that will result in someone getting hurt, I will do what ever it takes to stop it.

There are a lot of engineers who try to take on fiduciary responsibility. I personally do not. I make the best decisions possible in my own span of control to optimize safety, cost, environment, and reputation, and I will give my boss the best support I can so that he can make good decisions as well. But if my boss decides to make a costly decision, I won't stand in the way (as long as there is no safety implications).

If I see a high rate of bad financial decisions being made, it is time to find a new job.




"Why don't you knock it off with them negative waves? Why don't you dig how beautiful it is out here? Why don't you say something righteous and hopeful for a change?" Oddball, "Kelly's Heros" 1970

Please see FAQ731-376 for tips on how to make the best use of the Eng-Tips Forums.

 

[l3city]

Being this the case, follow "company's profit". Your current "boss" will fall into a big pile of s*&t sooner or later and he'll be in trouble. Let him sink by himself...but you do the right thing, your "boss" is not the one signing your check, but rather your company.

 

[l3city]

I agree with sms

 

[melone]

Have you voiced your concerns to your immediate boss? Does he believe that he is telling the truth? He may just be misinformed.... which is exactly what you are payed to prevent.

 

[deveng100]

melone
Boss should not be misinformed everytime...
It is right as well as duty to be informed...
It is the same stupid Ego

sms
what you say is correct..it is tactical...
And in any case it depends what is liability..
If it is human..definitely stand against it...
If it some big financial loss ..stand against

Still it is really tricky to get rid of this everyday riot

 

[KENAT]

deveng100

Sorry if my first post wasn't overly helpfull but at the end of the day it is an option, even if for financial or other reasons it's not a good/easy to take one.

SMS pretty much put how I feel. I have kicked up a stink over safety/regulatory compliance.

As to money, while I'll normally make my opinion known to at least my direct boss, I usually don't take it any further.

KENAT, probably the least qualified checker you'll ever meet...

 

[deveng100]

Exactly the way most of us put it..
You know mechanical engineers always find a optima...
Yes..every post here is useful....

Even randomness can be defined..remember guassian distribution...

I thank everone for their views...

As if now I feel mechanical engineers or civil chemical or those traditional discipline engineers are less prone to job change at slight invocation...

I am aware of IT industries where people change job as often as 3 times a year and most of them once a year.

A generation back..people use to retire from same company where they initiated their career

Still if huge public/common stake is involved, it is sometimes better to risk your own career growth

 

[melone]

So have you corrected your boss?

 

[deveng100]

Till now I am silent procastinator, because stakes were low
But as suggested, if situation demands action. it will be taken..
And what sms and Kenat suggest seems gud path of action

Never play with pigs in mud:- After some time you will find, they are enjoying and you are dirty

 

[melone]

So let me get this straight.... You know that your boss is spouting off without having the appropriate knowledge base, and you haven't thought it important enough to inform him/her? Don't you think that you have some obligation to educate him/her? Knowledge of a crime but nothing about it, makes you just as guilty.

 

[deveng100]

Melone.you have missed some thing..here is something from my question
"And you know that your boss is stupid arrogant creature who only see that no one opposes him any time for reason whatsoever.."
You can drag you horse to water,, but it is him who should drink that..

Never play with pigs in mud:- After some time you will find, they are enjoying and you are dirty

 

[jmw]

1) Who do you work for? Check the notice boards and see if there isn't a poster somewhere saying "The Customer pays your salary."
2) Check the mission statement. It will all be about the customer and what the company will do for him.
3) Do nothing rash but make sure you have another job opportunity somewhere. Find a positive way to bring the problem to the bosses attention. Don't brace him in his office with "That was kinda dumb, wasn't it?" Try "Hey boss, what's the plan for how we handle it when the widget fractures?" Let him think you believe he knows what he is doing. That way, he will say, "Oh s**t. Why didn't you say something at the time?" which brings me to:

Your current "boss" will fall into a big pile of s*&t sooner or later and he'll be in trouble.

Wrong.
Sooner or later there will be the sound of the s**t hitting the fan but don't ever imagine the boss will get the blame. You were at the meeting. There is a reason you were there, it is to take the blame.

JMW

http://www.ViscoAnalyser.com

 

[rcooper]

I had a situation where a programme manager gave an instruction to mislead one of our most profitable customers. Myself and the rest of the project team throught this could have huge consequences for the relationships between the companies, so asked for the instruction in writing, and refused to carry out the verbal instruction. The written instruction never came, presumable because the programme manager wanted to be able to have a scape goat if we lost this customer as a result of his instruction.

One of the core values of our company was to act ethically, and when it came to out appraisals we were all given top scores by our line managers for standing firm.

So if you get instructions from a manager which you think go against the good of your company, write a report/long e-mail to ensure the manager is aware of all the facts and ask for the instruction in writing. If he won't give it in writing, then don't carry out the instruction. (It needn't be anything so formal, you could just ask for an e-mail to clarify his requirements).

And similar to sms, I would't compromise on safety.